matadworf
Regular Member
Bergin: You're welcome. You have some close distances for these samples.
Hey just curious where are the coordinates that Salento estimated for Dodecad 12 K? Thanks
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Bergin: You're welcome. You have some close distances for these samples.
Hey just curious where are the coordinates that Salento estimated for Dodecad 12 K? Thanks
Distance to: | Anthony_C_scaled |
---|---|
0.03118023 | MKD_Anc:I10391___female___BC_300___Coverage_66.29% |
0.03328139 | MKD_BA:I7231___R-CTS7556___BC_1219___Coverage_72.93% |
0.03329729 | MKD_Anc:I10388___J-Y13128___BC_708___Coverage_67.44% |
0.03407186 | MKD_Anc:I10390___G-Z6494___BC_393___Coverage_67.94% |
0.03898782 | ALB_Çinamak_Anc:I14692___female___BC_950___Coverage_69.46% |
0.03966204 | MKD_Anc:I10385___female___BC_641___Coverage_69.29% |
0.04203850 | ALB_Çinamak_Anc:I14688___R-L51___BC_500___Coverage_66.52% |
0.04217829 | MKD_Anc:I10381___C-V86___BC_636___Coverage_22.20% |
0.04365851 | MKD_Anc:I10384___J-Y13128___BC_600___Coverage_65.57% |
0.04384365 | ALB_Çinamak_Anc:I16251___R-M269___BC_550___Coverage_36.88% |
0.04616448 | MKD_Anc:I10387___female___BC_600___Coverage_43.99% |
0.04792661 | ALB_Çinamak_Anc:I14690___R-CTS1450___BC_1050___Coverage_65.05% |
0.05081105 | ALB_Çinamak_Anc:I16253___J-Y21878___BC_476___Coverage_33.12% |
0.05129287 | MKD_Anc:I7233___female___BC_850___Coverage_74.59% |
0.05145260 | MKD_Anc:I10379___female___BC_641___Coverage_66.02% |
0.05351353 | GRC_Mycenaean_Palace_of_Nestor_BA:I13514___female___BC_1215___Coverage_76.28% |
0.05373817 | GRC_Palace_of_Nestor_EIA:I19368___female___BC_1010___Coverage_10.73% |
0.05438663 | MKD_Anc_outlier2:I10167___R-M269___BC_121___Coverage_12.67% |
0.05518335 | MKD_Anc:I8112___R-CTS1450___BC_664___Coverage_70.53% |
0.05540831 | MKD_Anc:I10383___female___BC_657___Coverage_67.48% |
0.05545206 | GRC_Mycenaean_Kastrouli_BA:I13577___G-Z7016___BC_1250___Coverage_24.67% |
0.05663489 | MKD_Anc:I10389___female___BC_600___Coverage_15.50% |
0.06018596 | GRC_Mycenaean_Palace_of_Nestor_BA_father.or.son.I13518:I13506_d___R-M269___BC_1135___Coverage_20.12% |
0.06075867 | GRC_Mycenaean_Palace_of_Nestor_BA:I13517_d___G-Z6494___BC_1328___Coverage_25.65% |
0.06172027 | ALB_Çinamak_Anc:I16254___J-Z622___BC_500___Coverage_13.08% |
0.06247463 | GRC_Mycenaean_Palace_of_Nestor_BA:I19366___female___BC_1328___Coverage_50.11% |
0.06273291 | ALB_Çinamak_Anc:I16256___female___BC_550___Coverage_24.95% |
0.06350233 | GRC_Mycenaean_Palace_of_Nestor_BA:I13518___R-PF7563___BC_1135___Coverage_81.11% |
0.06562402 | GRC_Mycenaean_Attica_BA:I15571___female___BC_1467___Coverage_43.29% |
0.06841955 | GRC_Mycenaean_Attica_BA:I16709___J-Y14434___BC_1419___Coverage_15.29% |
0.06875100 | MKD_Mdv:I2530___female___AD_1035___Coverage_58.80% |
0.07215136 | GRC_Kastrouli_Anc:I17962___T-S27463___BC_644___Coverage_41.33% |
0.07245051 | GRC_Mycenaean_Kastrouli_BA:I13579___J-Y14434___BC_1266___Coverage_18.01% |
0.07519836 | GRC_Mycenaean_Palace_of_Nestor_BA:I19364___R-M269___BC_1135___Coverage_12.16% |
0.07829703 | GRC_Mycenaean_Kastrouli_BA:I13578___female___BC_1312___Coverage_12.52% |
0.07920786 | GRC_Marathon_Rom:I7833___T-CTS3767___AD_340___Coverage_80.92% |
0.08026927 | GRC_Mycenaean_Attica_BA:I15582___female___BC_1516___Coverage_25.55% |
0.10844563 | GRC_Minoan_Zakros_BA:I14916___female___BC_1818___Coverage_13.17% |
0.10921204 | MKD_Anc_outlier1:I10392___J-BY94___BC_300___Coverage_67.05% |
0.11004986 | ALB_Çinamak_EBA:I14689___R-M269___BC_2555___Coverage_48.90% |
The Pelasgians are presented as 'formely their neighbours' with a homeland (?) in Thessaly.
He supposes that Athenians may have changed their language from 'Pelasgian' to Hellenic but he is unsure about the language Pelasgians were speaking originally but he supposes it was a 'barbarian' language whatever that means. Either way, both Hellenic and Pelasgian ethne are presented as essentially native in Greece.
Here's a thought for all these academics and people that spend 14 hours a day making models: Do some mtDNA analysis.
Stop focusing on Y-DNA alone and see the specific clades of mtDNA that existed in the steppe/caucus/middle east.
In the past many of us used to complain that studies were focused on mtdna because it was easier to work with.
The gradually increasing input of Anatolian admixture into Greeks over time only bothers the following (feel free to add to the list):
1) Greek autochthonist / Med-supremacist weirdo fringe types.
2) Modern Greeks with little Anatolian input, who want to turn ancient Greeks into medieval Vlacho-Bogdanians like their own medieval ancestors.
3) The "East-Med" gang of anthrogenica who need to protect the purity/origin of the "Levantine-input" in the Italian peninsula at all costs, so evidence of early Anatolian geneflow into Greeks is pissing them off.
What Lazaridis wrote on Twitter about the movement from Anatolia to the west. It is obvious that if there really was this movement it was everywhere to the east of Italy, in the whole Balkans, and it can also be found elsewhere, even to the west and to north of Italy, although autosomal DNA hides it more.
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.30.458211v1
Now one poster on Anthrogenica is accusing Lazaridis of political bias.
Pelasgians in this case being the exonym used for the pre-Greek speakers of the region and Hellenes the Greek speakers.
The Mycenean samples in the paper show an increase of both CHG and PPN in the Minoan substratum, evidence of a continuous gene flow from Anatolia (and adjacent) into the region in the Bronze Age, the Marathon and the Byzantine samples portraying the evolution of this geneflow, time to pack it in and get over it, the argument has ran its course.
Whatever. The point is you should not use Herodotus to support whatever you want to support.
Your issues are psychological.
Οh, is that right?
Why is that? Because you say so?
He doesn't say what you say.
Movements from Anatolia are consistent with the myths e.g. the myth o Pelops who is presented as Lydian or Phrygian. Movements from Levant are also consistend with the myths.
E.g. the Hellenes are expelled from Pthiotis by Cadmeans according to Herodotus.
There is a continuous input from Anatolian in Greece from the Neolithic (wich affect all of Europe) to the bronze age, with the latter enriched by CHG components (and PPN Levant as well?). We know that since the first paper on Minoans and Myceneans and nobody can deny that. This input goes even furter and reached Southern Italy by the middle bronze age, even before the proper Greek colonization as it's attested by the archeological findings of many Mycenaeans artifacts in Italy.
If I'm am not mistaken, then, this paper showed an even further "event" of "anatolian admixture" happening in the Iron Age and affecting the greek colonists on the Ionian coast (wich may have then spread to the rest of the aegean as well?). But I may have mistaken this point and would like to know other points of view.
So, there surely is continuity in the region and I think that the major scope of the paper was to show this continuity between Anatolia, Greece and the rest of the eurpean continent.
3) The "East-Med" gang of anthrogenica who need to protect the purity/origin of the "Levantine-input" in the Italian peninsula at all costs, so evidence of early Anatolian geneflow into Greeks is pissing them off.
Sample | TUR_Barcin_N | GEO_CHG | IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N | Levant_Natufian | RUS_Samara_HG |
TUR_Muğla_Değirmendere_615_BC | 69,2 | 14,9 | 12,9 | 1,5 | 1,5 |
TUR_Gordion_653-646_BC | 56,9 | 24,7 | 10,5 | 7,4 | 0,5 |
Greek_Dodecanese | 57,3 | 13,3 | 13,8 | 7,8 | 7,8 |
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