Anatolian Hypothesis: Lord Renfrew still a partial holdout

I mean... do you understand that, it's more your fantasme that Middle-Easterners turns to be the origin of Blonde hair, and not the inverse. Don't twist things for passing for the good guy, you are the one who shows an hate against a groupe ( neonazis, pejoratif term that you use for encompass a lot of different " white " people i guess " ) so you should be more prudent in the futur, and stop to follow Angela in every thing she says it start to become very lame.

Hey listen if the origin of blonde hair is from western hunter gatherers or Steppe people I'll be cool with that!! I couldn't care less where blonde hair came from to be honest.

And i have no idea what you're talking about in terms of me hating certain white people, I have nothing against any ethnicity. It's the skinheads I don't like.
 
Well, I can say that I now know a lot more than when I first started reading about population genetics, and the first source of knowledge to me was Maciamo's articles on R1b,R1a, Indo-Europeans, and Yamnaya. He frequently associated red and blonde hair to the IE horse riding conquerors, and still does.

In my naivety I thought that was science, irrefutable facts. And so I believed it, before learning that Maciamo is a mortal and not every word he writes is truth.

I was asking why do they still want them to be blonde after we learned Yamnaya's complexion from the samples collected ? why does it matter so much to them ? Nazis ? or is it because of their insecurity and they want something to be proud of ? why should we care about them or what Davidski believes ?

And even in the case that they were blonde, what does it matter, its a trait like any other, I don't see the problem with that, if a future sample turns out to be blonde will that automatically prove them right ?

****** feed on attention, and the pseudo-science they believe in doesn't deserve any.

Up until very recently all we could do was speculate about the pigmentation of ancient peoples. We now have dna from them to give us at least rough guidance.

As Promenade pointed out, we now know that the WHG had blue eyes, but were darker skinned than the incoming farmers from Anatolia, who almost all had at least one derived de-pigmentation snp (SLC24A5), and a good proportion of whom were derived for SLC45A2 as well. There were even a few who were predicted to have blonde hair. The same is true for some of the Hungarian farmers as is clear from Gamba et al.

See:
Cristina Gamba et al: https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms6257
ncomms6257-f3.jpg




The highest percentage of derived depigmentation alleles were found in the SHG, and as I pointed out before the EHG so far seem to have been dark haired, dark eyed, but fairer skinned.

The Yamnaya are a different story. We now have the Mathiesen et al paper as well as the Sandra Wilde paper, which show that they were darker on the whole than modern Europeans, whether or not a few of them might have carried one of the genes responsible for blonde hair.

Sandra Wilde et al: http://www.pnas.org/content/111/13/4832.full

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/early/2015/10/10/016477

Some of our newer members would do well to read the papers on ancient dna rather than relying on folk tales and the rantings of places like Stormfront. It seems reading is too arduous for them, however, or as some of us pointed out in another thread, it wouldn't matter anyway, as anything that contradicts peoples' quasi-religious beliefs is just to be ignored and denied.

Now, as to why all of this matters so much to Nordicists, Nazis, and Neo-Nazis, to explain it in detail would derail this thread even more, and I wouldn't be able to do it justice in the space permitted. Suffice it to say that by the 19th century northern European historians and anthropologists had created a theory that they were a superior race, allowed to have dominion over other inferior races through conquest or domination or colonialism, and the "mark" of their superiority was their relatively lighter pigmentation and certain other traits like skull shape, nose shape etc.

It has never gone away entirely, and is in fact experiencing a type of resurgence.

For these kinds of people, who have idolized the Indo-Europeans and claim total descent from them, to discover that they did not, in fact, fit this standard, and that indeed this "Aryan" race was a mixed group of people with high proportions of Near Eastern ancestry has been a body blow, and so they try to discredit the results of the papers whenever possible, or do a lot of special pleading, or, like a poster above, shift the discussion to the people of Andronovo from a later time period, who were indeed somewhat fairer, and with a somewhat different genetic mix, as if that will somehow change the fact that the people who brought all the elements of the "Indo-European package" together in Yamnaya were not whom they claimed or hoped, either genetically or physically.

Now, if you're asking me to explain the psychology of people attracted in this day and age to this kind of outmoded, a-scientific thinking, all I can offer is amateur psychology: early conditioning and teaching, personal or ethnic feelings of insecurity and inferiority, mental disorders, or some combination thereof. My father and his entire family are fair haired and eyed and I never heard it remarked upon, much less cited as some mark of superiority. This kind of thinking is, in my opinion, insane, but it can't be denied that there are people to whom it matters a great deal.

As to your last statement, I couldn't disagree more. Someone once said that all it takes for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing. Joseph Goebbels said that if you repeat a lie often enough it becomes truth. He should know: he did it and it worked. The Communists did it, the Nazis did it, all authoritarian leaders do it, but it works even in supposedly democratic countries. These people prey on the young and uneducated with this toxic stew of racist ideas. It is very dangerous. Their idiotic and a-scientific pronouncements have to be countered and exposed every single time they dare to utter them.
 
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The most sense to me for right now make the Armenian homeland including parts of Kurdistan and or Iran,from where it spread into Yamnaya.

Anyway about half of Yamna genetics seem to came from that region? the middle eastern component?
Lazaridis et al. (2016) proposes a people, likely from Iran, as the source for the Middle Eastern ancestry of the Yamna people, finding that "a population related to the people of the Iran Chalcolithic contributed ~43% of the ancestry of early Bronze Age populations of the steppe.
Yamnaya or steppe still will be the source for "northern" European languages,particularly Italo-Celtic R1b's and the related Tocharian that migrated east.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yamna_culture

However for Greek i believe it came from Armenia not the steppe,the Armenian and Greek R1b clade are related anyway.

I won't speculate about other languages.


This is Maciamo's explanation

Yamnayan DNA tested by Haak (2015), Wilde (2014), Mathieson (2015) showed that Yamna people (or at least the few elite samples concerned) had predominantly brown eyes, dark hair, and had a skin colour that was moderately light, lighter than Mesolithic Europeans, but somewhat darker than that of the modern North Europeans. This is not unexpected considering that these samples had about 25% of recent admixture from the Iranian Plateau (before the Indo-European migrations brought Northeast European genes to the region), which would have darkened their pigmentation. Other tests have confirmed that the vast majority of Mesolithic Europeans had blue eyes, and the high incidence of red hair among Northwest Europeans (who have the highest percentage of Yamna ancestry) as well as in the Volga-Ural region and in ancient Chinese depictions of the Tocharians from the Tarim Basin strongly suggest that red hair was found among Yamnayans, and that the genes for red hair (which also include some mutations for fair hair) were spread by R1b Indo-Europeans. (=> see The Origins of Red Hair)The high CHG admixture in elite Kurgan samples was not found in earlier Steppe cultures, apart from a single R1b sample from the Khvalynsk culture that differed from non-R1b samples in that regard. This indicates that a foreign intrusion from the South Caucasus is responsible for this unusually elevated CHG among the Yamna elite.
 
In Mathieson's study Balkans Chalcolithic and Malak Preslavets appear to have some 'EHG', mostly without any 'Yamnaya' admixture.
.

.
I1108 has 35% EHG belonging to Cris culture .......... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starčevo–Kőrös–Criș_culture
.
The odd thing is that the G2a found with the T1a ( there are 2 ) has zero EHG
.
What was found at Malak was that it was on the Danube river ( bulgarian side ) , it was an ancient boat building site and that the hills above Malak was a bird nesting area where the locals would feed on eggs and birds.
Some scholars state that anatolian and steppe migrations met at Malak ......there is also 30 skeltons found of which 20 have been Dna , mostly G2a, T1a, C1 and I1 ...........check web site for Malak ( also known as the Wallacian plain )
 
Ok
that is to all
Gedrosian Vs Caucasus
Gedrosian
''

and
So now I ask the genetists,
HOW much Caucasian component had Yamnaa?
I think that is a good point to start seperate the terms caucasian and steppe and out of India (gedrosia) theory
Gedrosia is in modern eastern Iran
also
is Iran middle-east ?
is South caucasus middle east?
is Turkmenistan middle east
was BMAC middle east !?
 
Gedrosia is in modern eastern Iran
also
is Iran middle-east ?
is South caucasus middle east?
is Turkmenistan middle east
was BMAC middle east !?

we are both smart enough
Baltic have bigger caucasus than gedrosian
and gasgones have bigger gedrosian than caucasus
and if R1b expand IE at the west
from where it pass so not absorve any caucasus component?
that why I ask how much Caucasus had Yamnaa?????

Gedrosia is not steppe,
but out of India theory
 
But you are ignoring the fact that opposite to these Myceneans the Americas that speak a German language share at least 1/3 of their ancestry from these very Germanic people that brought their language there. And importantly this Elite Dominance is also mirrored in their yDNA that is in far higher percentage compared to local yDNA.

You have at best 15% Steppe ancestry with local Minoan yDNA. And this is also mirrored in the fact that the sample with "most" Steppe admixture was actually a female.

You do not seem to have understood my point. The issue is that those Germanic-speaking Americans will have at least 1/3 or even half of their DNA directly coming from those British, or rather English people who spoke the English language, but those Englishmen themselves are only about ~30-40% of "original" Germanic stock, i.e. those from Scandinavia and Northern Germany. If we count English-speaking people from outside England, e.g. Wales or Ireland, the percentage is even much lower, perhaps on the order of ~15%. So those Americans are effectively "only" 15% "pure, original" Germanic.

That is, if your comparison were NOT between Americans and Englishmen, because we already know very well that an entire new culture and ethnicity called "English" came to exist between the birth of Proto-Germanic and the colonization of the Americas, you'd have a completely wrong and partial picture. The Americans do not descend from Scandinavian Proto-Germanic, what they descend heavily from are the Germanic-speaking Englishmen of Britain. Period. The very same way, the Mycenaeans definitely did not descend from Pontic-Caspian Proto-Indo-Europeans, they descended heavily from a later society with some Pontic-Caspian roots, who dwelled in the northern Balkans or maybe in the Armenian Plateau. If you see that.Those people, just like Englishmen or like Slavic-speaking Russians, were not 100% derived from the people who gave them their language.

So, if you see 15% of steppe ancestry in Mycenaeans, and not early, almost Proto-Greek Mycenaeans, but later Mycenaeasn from the end of the Bronze Age (~ 1200 BC), you may be almost sure that the "Proto-Greek" or maybe "Pre-Greek" admixture into Bronze Age Greece was much higher than 15%, perhaps more like 1/3 or 40%.
 
The only two explanations are it either didn't come from the steppes. And if it did the source population in these Steppes must have been quite different genetically to Yamnaya. And we have DNA from any culture that followes Yamnaya in the territory like Poltavka and Srubna and non of them had a significantly different genetic signature, We only see a rise of Ana-Neo. (But CT maybe?)

Do we have a reasonable number of samples from Ezero, Cernavoda, Cotofeni, Vucedol or Baden cultures? Those Balkanic cultures look like the most likely to have given birth to Proto-Greeks (considering the autosomal makeup of Mycenaeans), not Srubna or Poltavka. Srubna and Poltavka were post-Yamnaya steppe cultures, not Yamna-derived expansions to other regions.
 
@ygorcs

Yodization the replace of Djot with Yiot
Djot in Alphabet has a symbol of thunder and is sound was J

South Slavic comparing with other Slavic show yodization
Greek is full of yodization
concerning Thracian I see the word kalamindar and not kalamjdar
that is probably the reason S Slavic adopted yiot

letter ι yiot is not e in Greek but has laryngeal aspiration infront h γ (a kind of w sound)
But not a g
about the B G D it is known even in Attic by Kratinos the Athenean
as I posted before

But about Mycenean ikkos and Greek ippos
has nothing to do with Attic which is a separate evolution of Ionic

cause Mycenean horsemen e-ge-ta ικετες
in Homer can be found as επετες

So Q->P change started after 1200 BC and ended before Hesiodos

Mycenean is not the proto-Greek, but a component
it is one of many components of Greek that start around 1000-900 BC
and Mycenean is seperated from LIE around 2500 BC
that date is considered as the mark of Mycenean separation/evolution

Homeric poetry is called epos, not ikos
bravery of epetes not iketes

I see, but the purpose of your arguments is to show or propose what? I still didn't get it, honestly. Also, Homeric poetry was most probably written down during the Greek Dark Ages, well after the Bronze Age collapse, so what you see there probably represents Iron Age changes in the Greek language, around 1000-700 BC. That is too late for any comparison with PIE, LPIE or "Yamna".
 
I wouldn't call them all Nordicists, Nazis, and Neo-Nazis, allthough there are some of course. And all are stupid, but of that there are so many.
It is just that some people like to cling to a neat theory that was accepted at some point and that created a story they like.
This thread is about Lord Renfrew, and I mentioned earlier that Barry Cunliffe and Peter Bellwood are the same, retired academics who still cling to the Anatolian theory which is completley outdated. They are academics and they should know better. But they have build up a certain story and they don't want to see it destroyed. It is stupid, but are they therefore racists that think the Anatolian farmers were a superior race?
They've just listened to long to David Anthony and Spencer Wells and now they are hard to reprogram.
But that is far from Nazism.
You could as well call all Jews Zionists or all Muslims violent extremists.
In every race and every religion there are people not only proud, but also feeling superior because of being part of that group.
That being said, I've never checked Stormfront. And I won't, it is to boring. Just like those sites that try to explain prehistory by the bible.
 
I wouldn't call them all Nordicists, Nazis, and Neo-Nazis, allthough there are some of course. And all are stupid, but of that there are so many.
It is just that some people like to cling to a neat theory that was accepted at some point and that created a story they like.
This thread is about Lord Renfrew, and I mentioned earlier that Barry Cunliffe and Peter Bellwood are the same, retired academics who still cling to the Anatolian theory which is completley outdated. They are academics and they should know better. But they have build up a certain story and they don't want to see it destroyed. It is stupid, but are they therefore racists that think the Anatolian farmers were a superior race?
They've just listened to long to David Anthony and Spencer Wells and now they are hard to reprogram.
But that is far from Nazism.
You could as well call all Jews Zionists or all Muslims violent extremists.
In every race and every religion there are people not only proud, but also feeling superior because of being part of that group.
That being said, I've never checked Stormfront. And I won't, it is to boring. Just like those sites that try to explain prehistory by the bible.

Bicicleur, I was describing only one specific brand of idiocy. :) There are indeed many.

People who have published papers or books proposing a certain theory regarding the Indo-Europeans, and whose academic careers are based on that are going to be very loathe indeed to admit that they were wrong. That includes Renfrew and Barry Cunliffe, but I think it applies to David Anthony to some degree as well. This also applies to any field, not just population genetics or linguists or archaeology. It's human nature.

There is, however, no way to get around the fact that people like Chamberlain and most of the old school anthropologists and the man who funded the Journal of Indo-European Studies, and some prominent bloggers, and many of the posters we get who are denizens of different anthrofora are out and out racists. The words out of their very own mouths convicts them. Denying it isn't going to change that.

As for your examples, I do think that the vast majority of Jews are very loathe to criticize the Jewish state at least publicly, for reasons that I totally understand. I don't think that makes them racists. However, if some member of Likud starts pontificating that the Bible or some archaeological find, or some genetic test proves that the Ashkenazim are the "pure" descendants of the ancient Hebrews where Palestinians are all recent transplants from Sinai or Egypt, yes, he's probably a racist. No human group is free of such people. So, I am not indicting all Northern Europeans, or all people who believed or believe some outdated ideas about the Indo-Europeans as racists. What I am saying is that the identity of the guilty parties is obvious.
 
You meet them sometimes, and I guess you're right about these individuals, Angela.
But I never check Stormfront or similar sites, and I even don't know Chamberlain. He must be important in these neighbourhoods, but not in the areas where I'm looking to check some facts.
Yes I know Stormfront exists, though I don't check it. But I don't link everyone who talks about blond hair to Stormfront.

But sometimes I do see on TV some Jewish colonisers in the occupied territories who claim the land they have stolen from the aboriginal Palestines is their land because it is the promised land of God, and I see these guys are backed up by the Israeli government, it upsets me much.
 
But sometimes I do see on TV some Jewish colonisers in the occupied territories who claim the land they have stolen from the aboriginal Palestines is their land because it is the promised land of God, and I see these guys are backed up by the Israeli government, it upsets me much.

It's "Palestinians", and they're among the world's youngest nations.. I'm an Atheist, but if you check who was identified culturally and historically with the Land of Israel before 1900, you'd find the Jews.
 
I see, but the purpose of your arguments is to show or propose what? I still didn't get it, honestly. Also, Homeric poetry was most probably written down during the Greek Dark Ages, well after the Bronze Age collapse, so what you see there probably represents Iron Age changes in the Greek language, around 1000-700 BC. That is too late for any comparison with PIE, LPIE or "Yamna".

finally we seem to agree to a point,

as you noticed in my other posts
I say that Q->P change happened possibly because another wave of IE entered that Era
and might have nothing with Mycenean,
so your question about h infront of ippos (hippos) is answered I believed,

and now lets go back to the trees the pure Anatolian hypothesis of Renfrew and not the later evoluted linguistic of Atkinson etc etc
we consider the Anatolian hypothesis dead mainly due to this
the common name of early metal, mainly the copper,
but lets see

A good example of another borrowed word, at a much later point, is the word "copper":

Greek "Kypros" (the island)
Italic/Romance: Latin "cuprum", French "cuivre", Spanish "cobre"
Germanic: English "copper", German "Kupfer", Swedish "koppar"
Celtic: Irish "copar", Welsh "copr"
Non-IE: Basque "kobrea", Finnish "kupari"

Note how when comparing Germanic vs. Romance, the word is ignorant of Grimm's Law (it obeys, however, to the Second Germanic Sound Shift exhibited by German), or how it's ignorant of the loss of *p in Celtic. And of course, the word is found in Non-Indo-European languages.


so we both admit that Anatolian hypothesis is dead because we consider the trees and plants secondary
and the transimission of early metals as primary
i mean the expand of word copper had happened via Yamnaans to Europe
but look at the above

it is the same almost
and also word kastanea chestnut,
regardless the other trees and plants,

that is what bother me in the case of Anatolian vs steppe as homeland of IE
and believe me you have the same wonder.

and now lets go back to geneticks
before the Q-P change what we also find at Balkans except J2a of minoans and myceneans
we find J2b I4331


strange isn't it
we consider celts next to Scans and Germanic due to god Taranis=Thor
but do see the words like Nemeton etc etc
 
In Mathieson's study Balkans Chalcolithic and Malak Preslavets appear to have some 'EHG', mostly without any 'Yamnaya' admixture.

By Bronze Age some Balkan H&G ancestry would still have survived in the Balkans. That doesn't need H&G themselves to survive in the region. And those Balkan H&G were pretty much WHG with some ANE like admixture. Some people even described them as quite similar to SHG.

I wouldn't call them similar to SHGs, SHGs were roughly half EHG while Balkan HGs were only 13 percent EHG. They also had HG ancestry either attributed to the near east or a population basal to WHGs so they were unique in their own right. If Mycenaeans could have been reliably modeled as part Iron Gates or Malak Preslavets without any Armenian_BA or LNBA European population contribution don't you think this would have been included in the Lazaridis paper?

Also EHG ancestry in Malak Preslavets is from before 5500bc, Neolithic populations in Greece around 4000bc don't have any EHG ancestry so it's unlikely that neolithic balkan populations around this era brought EHG ancestry to Greece. EHG only appears in Greece much later on with the Mycenaeans after Yamnaya ancestry had been well establish in the balkans so a neolithic entrance of EHG to Greece without yamnaya ancestry is rather doubtful.

We know that Yamnaya ancestry was increasing from the early to the late bronze age in the balkans so why would Greece be isolated from this and why would it make more sense that EHG ancestry had to come from an earlier back migration that hasn't been observed so far? The EHG ancestry could have arrived ultimately from Armenia rather than a LNBA balkan/central-europe population, but doesn't it at least make more sense that EHG ancestry arrived in Greece during the late bronze age than it coming from Neolithic populations according to what we know so far? If so than it would have certainly come with Yamnaya ancestry.


.

.
I1108 has 35% EHG belonging to Cris culture .......... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starčevo–Kőrös–Criș_culture
.
The odd thing is that the G2a found with the T1a ( there are 2 ) has zero EHG
.
What was found at Malak was that it was on the Danube river ( bulgarian side ) , it was an ancient boat building site and that the hills above Malak was a bird nesting area where the locals would feed on eggs and birds.
Some scholars state that anatolian and steppe migrations met at Malak ......there is also 30 skeltons found of which 20 have been Dna , mostly G2a, T1a, C1 and I1 ...........check web site for Malak ( also known as the Wallacian plain )

Interesting do we know anything about the genesis of T1a into Europe? Maybe their group mixed with EHGs while G2a coming from Anatolia did not. Do you know what paper I1108 is from?
 
I am using Eupedia maps to make some see better the difference among Caucasian and Gedrosian

The Caucasian component

attachment.php




the Gedrosian component

attachment.php



and I ask again
how much Caucasus had Yamnaans
 
It's "Palestinians", and they're among the world's youngest nations.. I'm an Atheist, but if you check who was identified culturally and historically with the Land of Israel before 1900, you'd find the Jews.

Oh, man, let us not get into these muddled waters. You are confusing the formation of a distinct ethnicity (ethnogenesis) with the existence of that people. People exist way before specific and distinguishable ethnic groups. "Palestinians" as a common ethnic community distinct from people of Al-Sham (Syrian, Lebanese) or from the Sinai is indeed a recent, but natural (I hope you do not believe it was all part of an anti-Jewish conspiracy), phenomenon triggered by their historic troubles, the recent waves of immigration that reinforced their common origins against the different "others", the breakup of the Ottoman Empire, and so on. That land may have been "associated" with ancient Hebrews, but honestly it had not been Jewish-majority land for at least 1,800 years. That's more than the entire time of existence of the English, the Portuguese or the Hungarian ethnicities.

That said, Palestinians of course already lived there or very near Palestine for many centuries. Many of those who now label themselves "Palestinians" once had the label "Shamsi", "Mediterranean Arab", "Levantines", "Eastern Romans", "Israelites" etc. Ethnic identity is much more fluid than genetic ancestry. Genetically they're not distant from Lebanese (who were of course basically siblings to Hebrews even in language and cultural origin) and AFAIK they're basically very similar to Ashkenazi Jews minus all the European admixture.
 
there was not just one migration from the steppes, during the iron age or what ignited the iron age (hallstatt) equally involved a migration from the steppe which reinecke/bouzak styled the 'thraco-cimmerian' complex; turns out that that complex based on archaeology and metallurgical analysis is given further merit in form of aDNA with pre-scythian-IA_Hungary (martiniano et al) possessing karasuk(scythian-type) admixture, not present in previous chalcolithic steppe yamnaya/corded-ware and derived bronze age folks;
https://www.scribd.com/document/131652090/Rudolfinum-2007-0015-0036




 
I wouldn't call them similar to SHGs, SHGs were roughly half EHG while Balkan HGs were only 13 percent EHG. They also had HG ancestry either attributed to the near east or a population basal to WHGs so they were unique in their own right. If Mycenaeans could have been reliably modeled as part Iron Gates or Malak Preslavets without any Armenian_BA or LNBA European population contribution don't you think this would have been included in the Lazaridis paper?

Also EHG ancestry in Malak Preslavets is from before 5500bc, Neolithic populations in Greece around 4000bc don't have any EHG ancestry so it's unlikely that neolithic balkan populations around this era brought EHG ancestry to Greece. EHG only appears in Greece much later on with the Mycenaeans after Yamnaya ancestry had been well establish in the balkans so a neolithic entrance of EHG to Greece without yamnaya ancestry is rather doubtful.

We know that Yamnaya ancestry was increasing from the early to the late bronze age in the balkans so why would Greece be isolated from this and why would it make more sense that EHG ancestry had to come from an earlier back migration that hasn't been observed so far? The EHG ancestry could have arrived ultimately from Armenia rather than a LNBA balkan/central-europe population, but doesn't it at least make more sense that EHG ancestry arrived in Greece during the late bronze age than it coming from Neolithic populations according to what we know so far? If so than it would have certainly come with Yamnaya ancestry.

No one said it makes more sense. I said it is theoretically possible. And it is, especially if Yamnaya is just EHG+CHG.

Alan, I think talked about 3 scenarios and considered a movement from Armenia to be more likely.

Concerning Greece Neolithic, I don't know what has been published apart from those from Peloponnese, so I may miss something.

Concerning Yamnaya ancestry in Balkans, the source is just Mathieson?

I said that if the 'Yamnaya' ancestry in some Peloponnese Neolithic samples is something 'CHG-related' (Davidski's opinion) how do I know that the same isn't true about the rest that appear to have some in that paper?
 
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I wouldn't call them similar to SHGs, SHGs were roughly half EHG while Balkan HGs were only 13 percent EHG. They also had HG ancestry either attributed to the near east or a population basal to WHGs so they were unique in their own right. If Mycenaeans could have been reliably modeled as part Iron Gates or Malak Preslavets without any Armenian_BA or LNBA European population contribution don't you think this would have been included in the Lazaridis paper?
Also EHG ancestry in Malak Preslavets is from before 5500bc, Neolithic populations in Greece around 4000bc don't have any EHG ancestry so it's unlikely that neolithic balkan populations around this era brought EHG ancestry to Greece. EHG only appears in Greece much later on with the Mycenaeans after Yamnaya ancestry had been well establish in the balkans so a neolithic entrance of EHG to Greece without yamnaya ancestry is rather doubtful.
We know that Yamnaya ancestry was increasing from the early to the late bronze age in the balkans so why would Greece be isolated from this and why would it make more sense that EHG ancestry had to come from an earlier back migration that hasn't been observed so far? The EHG ancestry could have arrived ultimately from Armenia rather than a LNBA balkan/central-europe population, but doesn't it at least make more sense that EHG ancestry arrived in Greece during the late bronze age than it coming from Neolithic populations according to what we know so far? If so than it would have certainly come with Yamnaya ancestry.
Interesting do we know anything about the genesis of T1a into Europe? Maybe their group mixed with EHGs while G2a coming from Anatolia did not. Do you know what paper I1108 is from?
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/317094992_The_Genomic_History_Of_Southeastern_Europe
download full PDF ...right side
..

.
Red is EHG and IIRC blue is CHG
 

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