Religion Can Muslims live peacefully with Christians, and vice versa?

[Yetos]

Laws of the Abrahamics religions are very similar because they come from the same source. The only difference in Christianity is Christ and his message of love. For example, stoning a women was stopped by Christ while Muslim following the Old Testament still do that. Christ and his message of love change the western world, but not the religious institutions that to me most of the time has served political and economic agendas in similar pattern as they did before with the pagan gods.

No
No Europe is still under old religions,
Not Abraam's one,
most claim Christ, but not, under this we are all pagans, and ancient religions,
that is why we are still free, the collapse of Abraam religion happened at Europe at medieval times,
Abraamic religions do not think, neither philoshophize a stochastic phenomena,
that is why early christians slain scientists, and later 'specialized' on witch hunt,
but it ended few centuries now,
that is why we see a naked woman, at a beach, and we did not attack her, etc etc,
outside we christians all, but undeneath and inside us we are all still pagans,

WE DO NOT FORCE RELIGIOUS laws, neither WW1 neither WW2 was religious,
the religious wars were before centuries,

I agree that capitalism, only wants to produce sell and consume,
either pagans, either christians, either muslims, either jews, either hindu does not care.
so for the 'system' is ok,
BUT
no one will force me to obey his god, neither his law,
so as a free unit, i have the obligation to keep the free world, free, out of religion laws, etc etc

PS soon we will face the wrath of priests,
as happened when some 'free minds' faced religious laws-dogmas,
that is what we are facing,

 

[Twilight]

Another thing I can't be bothered to discuss. When someone tells you he hates your culture, will kill you unless you convert to his religion, and believes that by starting a catastrophic war he will usher in paradise, and he does everything to show you he believes it by actually beheading and crucifying people who won't convert, then any sane person would take him at his word.

All of the justifications and rationalizations in the world, and all the playing of the victim card won't change that fact.

I'm not sure about the victim card per say there will always be Religious extremists; for us Christians we have westboro and us Christians aren't beating people or picketing. Let's see what the Middle east holds for us in a couple of decades.


Example: http://www.godhatesfags.com

 

[blevins13]

Another thing I can't be bothered to discuss. When someone tells you he hates your culture, will kill you unless you convert to his religion, and believes that by starting a catastrophic war he will usher in paradise, and he does everything to show you he believes it by actually beheading and crucifying people who won't convert, then any sane person would take him at his word.

All of the justifications and rationalizations in the world, and all the playing of the victim card won't change that fact.

My point is that do we really have religious war here, or it is all fabricated as such. Follow the money say in US to understand who is behind it.....


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[Angela]

Yes, all those hundreds of thousands of refugees flooding into Europe are fleeing from made up images broadcast on the news. Puleeeze.

That's it. Done.

 

[blevins13]

Yes, all those hundreds of thousands of refugees flooding into Europe are fleeing from made up images broadcast on the news. Puleeeze.

That's it. Done.

That is effect Angela, not the cause.... and those images are unfortunately real. But the question is we're the guns and money are coming from and that will provide you an outcome that this war is fought with Christian made guns so it is all business after all nothing religious about it. It is christians helping muslims to fight each other for dominion of the region simple as that.


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[Yetos]

That is effect Angela, not the cause.... and those images are unfortunately real. But the question is we're the guns and money are coming from and that will provide you an outcome that this war is fought with Christian made guns so it is all business after all nothing religious about it. It is christians helping muslims to fight each other for dominion of the region simple as that.


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indeed that is an interesting view, and has a bit of truth,
Capitalism does care who will die,
for him muslims and christians are just numbers,

BUT
i wonder why Pakistanis come, since no war there?
why Ukraine or Ossetia ddid not cause such mess?
why South America starvine and mess did has such effect,
but only Arab spring!!!!!

 

[Fire Haired14]

That is effect Angela, not the cause.... and those images are unfortunately real. But the question is we're the guns and money are coming from and that will provide you an outcome that this war is fought with Christian made guns so it is all business after all nothing religious about it. It is christians helping muslims to fight each other for dominion of the region simple as that.

What Christians are giving Muslim terrorist guns? If you're trying to say the West has helped Muslim terrorism grow you should know the West isn't officially Christian. Our governments are officially secular. Nothing they do is supposed to be for the purpose of a religion. Most of our people are secular, but identify as Christian few times year.

 

[Fire Haired14]

I believe, that all the conflict between Christian and Muslim is fueled by the economic interest in Middle East. The world has only one issue unbalanced capitalism fueled by greed.

You think *all* the conflict is caused by economic interests even though *Islamic* Terrorist groups say otherwise. Maybe some but definitly not *all* of the conflict is a result of economic interests. What people claim to be the reason for war might hide hidden reasons but it's foolish to say THE reason are the hidden reasons. Leaders in the world are more honest than you think. Conspiracy Theories are never fully true.

 

[Fire Haired14]

Muslims and Christians can definitely live together in Peace. Catholics and Protestants learned to. There were countless wars fought in Europe during the Reformation which were like previews to WW1 and WW2.

Lets say Muslims would have to contradict their religion to live in peace with Christians, so what. They still will because the majority of people in every religion don't really follow their religion, they follow society. This is why Christians have fought each other so much, even though the New Testament arguable teaches Pacifism.

 

[blevins13]

indeed that is an interesting view, and has a bit of truth,
Capitalism does care who will die,
for him muslims and christians are just numbers,

BUT
i wonder why Pakistanis come, since no war there?
why Ukraine or Ossetia ddid not cause such mess?
why South America starvine and mess did has such effect,
but only Arab spring!!!!!

Emigration is a different story maybe we can open a new thread and elaborate there. Maybe research might show that emigration could be related after all to DNA or to other reasons.


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[blevins13]

You think *all* the conflict is caused by economic interests even though *Islamic* Terrorist groups say otherwise. Maybe some but definitly not *all* of the conflict is a result of economic interests. What people claim to be the reason for war might hide hidden reasons but it's foolish to say THE reason are the hidden reasons. Leaders in the world are more honest than you think. Conspiracy Theories are never fully true.

"Foolish" is too much, focus on the argument not on the person. I am just saying look who is financing the terrorists to understand who is behind and the reason for doing so. War needs more than anything money.


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[Piro Ilir]

That is effect Angela, not the cause.... and those images are unfortunately real. But the question is we're the guns and money are coming from and that will provide you an outcome that this war is fought with Christian made guns so it is all business after all nothing religious about it. It is christians helping muslims to fight each other for dominion of the region simple as that.


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Qatar Turkey and Saudia are close allies of USA. To the other hand Iran is allied to Russia. The whole is a geo strategic game. Maybe some of the soldiers are really religious but the rulers aren't.
I don't think that the royal family of Saudia cares about Islam.

 

[Piro Ilir]

Dear LeBrok, this is a whole different discussion which I started. My argument is that capitalism works by stimulated entrepreneurs, but it has to be more balanced like Nordic system, or than greed for more and more prevails and destroys everything. In Middle East the interests of unbalanced capitalist countries have caused the mess not the religion.


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Lets see. The four major players in middle east are: Iran, Russia, Saudia and Turkey. All of them are involved in a large scale there and that's not a secret. Neither of them isn't a real democracy. So you blame the Western world! !! The involvement of the West there is very weak.

 

[Piro Ilir]

I trully hope that you (and Trump) will start with the Turks and Saudi Arabia being 'racist' toward them and 'whop their as$es'. Those countries are the biggest donors of the Islamo-fascism and terrorism. So, please don't talk, just DO IT!!!

Seems till now that Trump's attempts will be against Iran.

 

[Piro Ilir]

It is an inconvenient fact that Islam is unique among the major world religions in having a developed doctrine of warfare against non-believers. To give an example: Chapter 9 Verse 29 of the Qur'an says to fight the non-believers including Christians and Jews, until the latter pay a poll tax and feel themselves subdued, that is, they submit to the rule of Islam.

Does it make me hateful or bigoted to speak this on this forum?

To answer the question: Yes, of course they can, but it would not be consistent with Islam. It would depend on the particular Muslim.
People have different levels of religious knowledge and fervor. There are some people who are perfectly aware of these problematic aspects of their religion yet choose to live life as regular people. But it is also true that people with an extremist bent can use Islam to justify hatred and violence against non-believers of all kinds.

The verses of Quran needs a professional interpretation.
There is no allowed the force conversion in Islam. This includes all the Muslim subgroups.

 

[Piro Ilir]

I agree, I hope Trump reconfigures the US's NATO alliances, and removes Turkey from NATO altogether.
Turkey was important to NATO during the cold war due to its geography, but now the communist empire doesn't exist anymore. If the allies could align themselves with Stalin against Hitler, I don't see why NATO can't align itself with Russia against global jihad. We need new alliances.

Indeed we already have an opposite organization of NATO. ~Shanghai-p. Russia, China , Iran, North Korea and India, are the main members of this eastern organization.
The jihadist threat isn't comparable with the Nazis threat.

 

[Piro Ilir]

I agree..............we need Russia more than we need Turkey

Turkey had a lot to answer for even if we only begin from WW1

For what we need Russia! Unless of it undemocratic behaviour of course. WWI! !!!! Are you serious!
If we will bring Turkey out of NATO, Turkey will join the Shanghai-p. Putin already offered a lot of concessions to Erdogan for that.
The main goal of Putin is the free passage into the straight of Bosphorus.

 

[blevins13]

Lets see. The four major players in middle east are: Iran, Russia, Saudia and Turkey. All of them are involved in a large scale there and that's not a secret. Neither of them isn't a real democracy. So you blame the Western world! !! The involvement of the West there is very weak.

The major player for many years in Middle East is US.


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[Piro Ilir]

You would be right if Islamic fundamentalists of Sunni didn't exist. Unfortunately their vision of the world is Caliphate with all infidels dead. They are the once who bring hatred, terror and death to other Muslims and to the whole world. This is less of economic issue and way more ideological one. After all, this ideology stems from rich Saudi Arabia. Capitalism has nothing to do with it, as their oil is in private hands of royal families, and economi heavily regulated by bureaucrats.

The two branches: Sunnism and Shiite are the owners of the Persian gulf. The radical sunnism looks more extremist simply because the Sunni branch it's larger. There's another reason. The Arabs are almost Sunny and the Shiite aren't. Hence we have a more conservative Islam in Sunnis, due to their nomadic and tribal lifestyle. Iranians are different culturally. The cultural background plays an important role or effect in Muslims. Nevertheless, either in Shiites we have a lot of extremism.

 

[Piro Ilir]

Laws of the Abrahamics religions are very similar because they come from the same source. The only difference in Christianity is Christ and his message of love. For example, stoning a women was stopped by Christ while Muslim following the Old Testament still do that. Christ and his message of love change the western world, but not the religious institutions that to me most of the time has served political and economic agendas in similar pattern as they did before with the pagan gods.

The so called modern system~ liberal democracy~ is the continuity of the ancient Athenian democracy, and our Western civilization has nothing to do with the monotheistic religion and the dark age .
The idol of George Washington was the ancient Roman hero of the republic called Cincinatus.
The USA republic it's founded as a revive of the Roman republic, and not as a medieval theocratic state.