First Genomes from Ancient Egypt

[Wanderer]

Afrocentrists and Woke are synonyms. I personally am not in the habit of looking down on someone's culture or origins or a people's background. I have a lot of respect for the culture and origins of all people. The woke (this is a word that I have a hard time understanding what it means, so I take it as synonymous with “Afrocentrist of the United States”) desperately want a great ancient civilization to call their own. The blacks who came to the Americas have nothing to do with the ancient Egyptians or even the modern ones. Black Americans are descendants of Niger-Congolese peoples originally from West Africa and the term 'Black’ in its meaning achieved in the United States cannot be applied to Egyptians, descendants of Western Eurasians whose SSA heritage (much smaller in percentage terms) comes mostly from East African peoples who themselves were already quite mixed with western Eurasians. Instead of claiming ancient Egypt as the great black civilization of the past, which is a big lie, they should seek to extol the great contribution of West Africans to Western culture in sports, music, cuisine, etc, etc.

I am not an afro centrist. I dont believe africans were indigenous peoples of the americas. But the old original egyptians and yes cushites and horners and sudanese today are black people. Some are more admixed than others, but the majority are evidently black.
Yes, African americans are niger congo? What's your point. Only niger congo look black?

 

[Duarte]

I am not an afro centrist. I dont believe africans were indigenous peoples of the americas. But the old original egyptians and yes cushites and horners and sudanese today are black people. Some are more admixed than others, but the majority are evidently black.
Yes, African americans are niger congo? What's your point. Only niger congo look black?

Objective answer: The ancient Egyptians were not black.

You have a simplistic view of ethnicity (or race, if you prefer) relating the term mainly to skin color. This simplistic view is the same as that of white supremacists who think that ethnicity is primarily defined by skin color, eye color, hair color, hair type.

 

[Wanderer]

Objective answer: The ancient Egyptians were not black.

You have a simplistic view of ethnicity (or race, if you prefer), relating the term mainly to skin color. This simplistic view is the same as that of white supremacists who think that ethnicity is primarily defined by skin color, eye color, hair color, hair type.

Also features, many having coarse or nappy hair. Full lips, and many have wide or flat noses. Or bulbous noses. But yes, notably, skin color also.

Ethnicity isn't, but they would still be black if they look black. Black is the color and look.
Also, white supremacists dont lock ethnicities to looks. They know two people can be the same ethnic group but have more or less certain continental ancestry designations like european or african. Even if technically those people are of the same ethnic group, they are more related to each other than to the white supremacists who would be in some way different ethnic group. Still, one of them would be black, and one could be much lighter, would still be kin despite what a white supremacists think.

Objective answer, they were brown and black. Some were light, but that's more up northern egypt. Not in the south closer to land of punt (upper egypt)

With later egyptians progressing to be lighter later on.

 

[Duarte]

@Wanderer.

I disagree of you.
The Egyptians were and remain MENA (Middle Eastern and North African). I agree, and only in this, that the ancient Egyptians and Jesus Christ did not even remotely resemble those Nordic types portrayed by Hollywood in the movies.

 

[Angela]

Mel Gibson did better than most in his movie "Passion of the Christ"...even if he had to put dark contacts and a prosthetic nose on his actor.

Wound up with the most beautiful Christ figure I've ever seen imo, and not too far from early depictions, which, however, may not have been particularly close to the look of the Jews of Palestine, who might have looked more like modern Samaritans.

Of course, we have Michelangelo's Pieta, whose Christ figure was modeled by a young Jewish man from the Roman ghetto. He might, however, given what we now know, have had some Southern European ancestry.

 

[Wanderer]

Mel Gibson did better than most in his movie "Passion of the Christ"...even if he had to put dark contacts and a prosthetic nose on his actor.

Wound up with the most beautiful Christ figure I've ever seen imo, and not too far from early depictions, which, however, may not have been particularly close to the look of the Jews of Palestine, who might have looked more like modern Samaritans.

Of course, we have Michelangelo's Pieta, whose Christ figure was modeled by a young Jewish man from the Roman ghetto. He might, however, given what we now know, have had some Southern European ancestry.

Yeah christ was middle eastern levantine though.

 

[real expert]

I doubt that the Samaritans resembled the first- century Jews in appearance that much because the Samaritians are a highly inbred people. In my opinion, the Jews during the time of Christ perhaps looked like modern Lebanese or Syrians. In the film Chosen, for instance, an actor of Syrian descent played Jesus, and the majority of the other cast members, including Israelis, were of Middle Eastern origin.


Here's Jonathan Roumi. I found that he played Jesus in a relatable way.

And these actors portrayed his disciples.

 

[Wanderer]

I think Levantines would have resembled pre ashkenazi jews (who have european)

Being that jews were originally a Levantine people that are closely related to other levantine peoples like canaanites and palestinians. It only makes sense jesus would have been levantine himself.
In fact judaism is really an offshoot of Cananite Pantheon also. Yahweh was originally a cannite diety. But a sect if Yahweh followers broke off and declared him as their only and true god. Then he became synonymous with god.

 

[mount123]

I am not an afro centrist. I dont believe africans were indigenous peoples of the americas. But the old original egyptians and yes cushites and horners and sudanese today are black people. Some are more admixed than others, but the majority are evidently black.
Yes, African americans are niger congo? What's your point. Only niger congo look black?

Of course you are or how would one else describe the non sense you've posted here and on multiple other posts.

You repeatedly make bizarre statements based on your non existent archaeological and scientific foreknowledge. Nontheless, even if linked you would not read what scientific papers have to say as it obviously does not suit your bias (mixed race heritage as you have pointed out).

 

[Wanderer]

Of course you are or how would one else describe the non sense you've posted here and on multiple other posts.

You repeatedly make bizarre statements based on your non existent archaeological and scientific foreknowledge. Nontheless, even if linked you would not read what scientific papers have to say as it obviously does not suit your bias (mixed race heritage as you have pointed out).

If I was an afro centrist, I would believe everything was created by black people. Dont fall into this weird slippery slope fallacy.
They just look black to me. Dont know what else to say

https://smarthistory.org/running-horned-woman-tassili-najjer-algeria/

 

[mount123]

If I was an afro centrist, I would believe everything was created by black people. Dont fall into this weird slippery slope fallacy.
They just look black to me. Dont know what else to say

https://smarthistory.org/running-horned-woman-tassili-najjer-algeria/

When I image search the stuff you post here, it leads me to twitter accounts using the hashtag "blackgirlmagic".

 

[Angela]

He's a t-roll. Ignore him.

 

[MOESAN]

I am not an afro centrist. I dont believe africans were indigenous peoples of the americas. But the old original egyptians and yes cushites and horners and sudanese today are black people. Some are more admixed than others, but the majority are evidently black.
Yes, African americans are niger congo? What's your point. Only niger congo look black?

'black' is not an anthropologic term. There was 'negroid' in old times, more or less precise, but roughly based on a convergence of considered typical features taking in account bones of head and body, flesh parts, form of hair and so on.
"black" signifies nothing.

Speaking simply, the most of Eastern Africa (the Horn) pops shows features putting them between western Eurasians and Western SSA Africans. The ancient Egyptians we could devine based on pictures of the times were mixed, rather on the wetsern Eurasian side, IMO. Concerning Elites, they changed by time, and it seems relatively pure Europoids took the power during someperiods, I don't know details about the timing of changes of elites.
We may suppose that at the dawn of high culture Egypte, the general pop was not a "pure" one concerning the classical anthropologic criteria, but we may not say either they were "black" people or dominantly 'negroid' people.
A very boring question, this no end discussion about "black Egypt".
You can only say they were Africans for the most, according to Geography.

 

[MOESAN]

"but we may not say either they were "black" people or dominantly 'negroid' people."

Maybe my phasing here is mistaking (bad English). I would say clearly: they were not "black" people, they were not dominantly 'negroid' people.

 

[Hawk]

"but we may not say either they were "black" people or dominantly 'negroid' people."

Maybe my phasing here is mistaking (bad English). I would say clearly: they were not "black" people, they were not dominantly 'negroid' people.

Why cannot they be a culture predominantly descending from native Mesolithic North African people. Why should they be either West Eurasian/Caucasus or Negroid?

 

[Wanderer]

When I image search the stuff you post here, it leads me to twitter accounts using the hashtag "blackgirlmagic".

Thats cute but they actually look black or black mixed soo...

 

[Wanderer]

'black' is not an anthropologic term. There was 'negroid' in old times, more or less precise, but roughly based on a convergence of considered typical features taking in account bones of head and body, flesh parts, form of hair and so on.
"black" signifies nothing.

Speaking simply, the most of Eastern Africa (the Horn) pops shows features putting them between western Eurasians and Western SSA Africans. The ancient Egyptians we could devine based on pictures of the times were mixed, rather on the wetsern Eurasian side, IMO. Concerning Elites, they changed by time, and it seems relatively pure Europoids took the power during someperiods, I don't know details about the timing of changes of elites.
We may suppose that at the dawn of high culture Egypte, the general pop was not a "pure" one concerning the classical anthropologic criteria, but we may not say either they were "black" people or dominantly 'negroid' people.
A very boring question, this no end discussion about "black Egypt".
You can only say they were Africans for the most, according to Geography.

Yea thats why they maybe look black. I mean if you go on a pca plot west Africans are much closer to europeans then san peoples. But you wouldnt stop and say west africans arent black right?

 

[kingjohn]

The latest King Tut reconstruction. He looks a lot more West Eurasian, than his coffin would initially lead one to believe.

Nice jovialis,
He belonged to haplogroup r1b
I wonder if he belonged to the same branch
As this bronze age individual I2062 from israel Tel -Shadud
Which is likely canaanite ( personally wasn't aware of this finding)
https://www.theytree.com/sample/e66e13968dbeb38573b1fb37632c1b5b.html


the site :
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tel_Shaddud

 

[MOESAN]

If I was an afro centrist, I would believe everything was created by black people. Dont fall into this weird slippery slope fallacy.
They just look black to me. Dont know what else to say.

---------

Wanderer, the pics you psted show:
1- diversity among old Egyptians looks
2- the most of them show some crossings between what we call 'europoid' types ans 'negroid types', often rather on the 'euro' side
3- one of the mummies show clearly a typical 'europoid' agressive nose very far form the 'negroid' type
So nothing very neat

@others
- all typical wokes (an unlevel pop) are not afrocentrists (except the historical first American ones)
- we don't know exactly what was Jesus Christ true look
- at the time and in the region he lived there was crossings and variations among Near-East people (almost purely 'Europoid' looking, by the way)- out of topic

 

[MOESAN]

Look black to me despite what their dna test may say.

Yu have some problems with your eyes!