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Free and independent Kurdistan is coming soon.
Goga
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Putin is more pro-West and pro-Europe than the US. The US has been always against the interests of Europe. The US imperialism is occupying Europe. Europe is a colony of America. And the US is blackmailing Europe with Islam. Sooner or later Russia will liberate Europe from NEO-Nazi Islamo-fascism. Like Russia liberated Europe from NAZI-Germany.
Boreas
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50 million Kurds?
How popular the idea of indepence beetween Kurds, this is not clear issue.
[url]http://www.kurdpress.com/En/NSite/FullStory/News/?Id=3918#Title=%0A%09%09%09%09%09%09%09%09Ocalan is not seeking independent state: BDP deputy%0A%09%09%09%09%09%09%09[/URL]
If the scenario in Goga's mind happens, their situation will be like Armenian. Yes They can have independent country, but they will loose many lands, but I guess they still have a oil zone of Turkey.
How popular the idea of indepence beetween Kurds, this is not clear issue.
[url]http://www.kurdpress.com/En/NSite/FullStory/News/?Id=3918#Title=%0A%09%09%09%09%09%09%09%09Ocalan is not seeking independent state: BDP deputy%0A%09%09%09%09%09%09%09[/URL]
If the scenario in Goga's mind happens, their situation will be like Armenian. Yes They can have independent country, but they will loose many lands, but I guess they still have a oil zone of Turkey.
Angela
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Russia has never been for anybody but Russia. Ask the Germans whether it was better to have lived in West Germany or East Germany. Ask the Poles what it was like to be "liberated" by Russia. Ask the people of Berlin what it was like to be "liberated" by Russians compared to the Americans. The Russians raped everything female from ten to eighty and stole everything that wasn't nailed down to ship back to Russia. They had to build a WALL to keep people from fleeing the benevolent Russian occupation of East Berlin and East Germany in general. We have to build a wall to keep people OUT.
How can you believe these things? What have you been reading? Who have you been talking to?
There's no point in responding to such comments.
If this is the mindset of the Kurds no wonder Obama has been giving them only half hearted support. Sounds like old school Communist/Maoist fellow traveler rhetoric
Goga
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Yes, 50 million Kurds. Maybe even more.
APO was against a Kurdish state, because he was against a total war. He tried to achieve something for the Kurds through democracy. He tried to save a Turkish state. With dialogue Kurds could only gain a some kind of autonomy. But there will be a total war. Turks don't understand a different language. My people are already well prepard for a great war. And Kurds are not going to fight a great patriotic liberation war for some kind of autonomy, but for an independent Kurdish state, Great Kurdistan.
When Armenians or Greeks were at war with Turks, there was just a very few Armenians, but now there're 50 million Kurds. If there were just 2 million Kurds, Kurds could loose. 100 years ago there were in total just 4 million Kurds. But today there're 50 million Kurds. How does somebody want to defeat so much people, especially 50 million Kurds? That's impossible! This is something different. A different level. We will never give up any inch of Kurdish soil. All historic Kurdish lands and there where Kurds are a majority will be part of Great Kurdistan, very inch of it.
Kurds would accept autonomy through democracy and dialog. But we will never accept any autonomy after a war. WAR = more sacrifices, more Kurds killed = independent Kurdish state, Kurdistan or what Kurds call Kurdewarî.
Goga
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Just wait and see. Kurdish SUN shines high and bright above Kurdewarî, but only in couple of month, within a year the Kurdish SUN will shine even higher and brighter above Kurdewarî and especially Amed, the true capital of Great Kurdistan.
ElHorsto
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In europe there is a popular cliché about uneducated americans who still believe that Russians are communists and Germans are nazis. I'm surprised that you fit in half way, because actually you know better.
Angela
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Perhaps you should read my post again. I believe you will see that it was Goga who identified Germany and Europe in general as Neo-Nazi. I neither said nor implied any such thing.
He furthermore had waxed poetic about the wonderful Russian liberation of Europe after World War II. I corrected his obviously uninformed statements with a little historical background.
I don't know what I'd call the leaders of Russia today. A toxic oligarchy composed of the Russian Mafia and ex KGB officers who are plundering their country and want to do the same to others? That's a mouthful. I'll have to think of something better.
What I do know is that anybody who thinks that ex KGB officer Putin has become a social democrat who wants to be a benevolent friend to Europe has perhaps been smoking something other than tobacco.
What I also know is that leftist Europeans in general are dangerously naive, in my opinion. Or perhaps they're willfully stupid. I can't make up my mind.They still haven't learned the lessons of history, that's for sure. The left was sold a bill of goods. I know it's tough to swallow but it's true. Nor did the fascists have the answer. Millions upon millions dead because of two failed ideologies. Even more millions lost in World War I for virtually NOTHING.
America saved Europe twice in one century from their blood letting binges, three times if you count Kosovo. Who are Europeans to condescend to America or to hold themselves up as some sort of models?
As for your subtle insult, I won't respond in kind. I'll just say that I'd put my education and my intellect up against anyone you care to name. I'd also just mention that people tend to resort to personal insult when they have no substantive argument.
Alan
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Goga represents only his own opinion.... I was expecting more user knowledge from you at this point. Obama only gives half hearted support to Kurds because of NATO ally Turkey nothing more. Russia today is not UDDSR but I agree that literally every part of Europe which was dominated rather by Russia is far behind.
But todays Russia is not Communist anymore. Only ideological idiots with no brain and no knowledge whatsoever still believe Communism does work if even the former definition of Communism (Russia) has turned it's back towards this ridiculous type of system.
In fact todays Russia is ideologically and by system closer to Europe and even the US than Communist China or North Korea. Also Russia is supportive towards Kurds that must be said but honestly I don't see them really do more for us than the EU or US.
You can't hate Putin for simply doing what he thinks is the best for his country.
Boreas
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Please, give some reliable sources
https://kurdishissue.files.wordpress.com/2015/06/kurds-population.png
Kurdish population increase can be compare muslim population increase in the West, so you are saying Turks should have done protest against Kurdish population increase something like in West Europeans protests against Muslim.
so the idea of the founder of PKK is not important and you think all kurds(50 million) unite on your view.
How many people can able to took their great lands; Armenians, Greeks, Bulgarians, Germans, Turks? Answer is no.
Alan
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I don't know if I had said this hear already before, but it wasn't false pretextes. With what did Saddam Gas the Kurds if he didn't have weapons of mass destruction? I know from Kurds who live and lived on the border region and tell me before the Iraq War started the people saw convoys of trucks leaving Iraq towards Syria.
Now Saddam and Assad are both belong to the Arab nationalistic Baath party. And where do you think Assad got most of his chemical weapons from? Saddam had them, and it is not so hard to hide or get rid of them if you have friendly neighbors such as Syria, Turkey and Saudi Arabia.
@Boreas
I honestly don't feel the lust now to discuss with you about these issues. But Let me just say the Kurdish pop in general is around 40 mio.
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Angela
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I don't disagree with most of what you say. The Kurds do deserve their own country. I'm just relaying some of the reasons for the reported hesitation of the Obama administration toward arming the Kurds. The Turks are of course part of the consideration, but so, according to news reports, is the factionalism among the Kurds and the ideology of some of the Kurdish groups. Americans have had too much of arming "freedom fighters" only to have them turn into autocrats. Maybe the administration is blowing it out of proportion and it's just an excuse for inaction on their part . I sincerely hope that's the case. The Republican candidates to a man are for arming them immediately. As you say, there aren't many choices.
As for George W Bush we'll have to agree to disagree. Is he my favorite president? No. Did he make mistakes? Yes. In retrospect, should we have gone into Iraq? No, we shouldn't. However, I don't for a minute believe there was some nefarious purpose behind it. He believed that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction because every intelligence service in the world believed it. People have very short memories.
We also gained nothing from it, nothing; we just lost...treasure, but most of all, blood, the blood of patriotic young men and women, and the blighted lives of the wounded. The vast majority of Americans also lost any appetite for any nation building in the Middle East or fighting other people's battles. That's a big part of why Obama got elected. It's also why his inaction with regards to ISIS and the general deterioration in the Middle East and North Africa was perfectly fine with most Americans. Whether the barbarity of what has been going on in the Near East and now in France and fear that we'll get hit again will change their minds remains to be seen.
Goga
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Because people are afraid of Kurdish nationalism they don’t mention the real numbers of Kurdish population. They said that the population of Kurds in Rojava was only 1 million, while the real Kurdish population in Rojava is at least 3-4 million. Same can be said about all other parts of Kurdistan. It's much more than people say.
3 - 4 million in Rojava, Kurmanji Kurds
7 - 8 million in Southern Kurdistan, Sorani, Kurmanji and other ethnic Kurdish minorities.
8 - 10 million in Eastern Kurdistan
25 - 30 million in Northern Kurdistan, Kurmanji Kurds
6 - 8 million Feyli Kurds
4 - 5 million Zaza Kurds
1 million Ezdi Kurds
3 - 5 million Kurds in diaspora
Let's take the lowest estimations. It's at least 57 million ethnic Kurds. Too much to handle, even for a superpower like the US!
3 + 7 + 8 + 25 + 6 + 4 + 1 + 3 = 57 million
As long APO is at the enemies hands, we don't care about APO's current opinion. There're at least 50 million Kurds, so we have many other genius (high IQ) people among us within our pan-Kurdish organisation who can lead us.
Just let wait and see. This will happen very soon. All I know that Kurds will fight for every inch of Kurdistan. And that we have got enough Kurds to die for every inch of Kurdistan.
Armenians, Greeks, Germans, Turks lost their war. But Kurds are not going to lose any war. We will never lose this very important patriotic independent war against the Turks. Do always remember that the winners decide the boundaries and redraw the map. And I can guarantee you that the Kurds will be the undisputed winners in their war against the Turks. There is no way we are going to fail. This is impossible. Sure many will die, but we are going to defeat the Turks, it is just as simple as that and just a matter of time...
Alan
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~3 mio in Syrian Kurdistan and Syrian diaspora
~6 mio Iraqi Kurdistan
~18 mio in Turkeys Kurdistan and Turkish cities
~10 mio in Iranian Kurdistan and large Iranian cities.
~4 mio in other Diaspora countries.
~6 mio Iraqi Kurdistan
~18 mio in Turkeys Kurdistan and Turkish cities
~10 mio in Iranian Kurdistan and large Iranian cities.
~4 mio in other Diaspora countries.
Goga
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Maybe 6 million Kurds in Southern Kurdistan only, but what about Baghdad? In Baghdad are at least 2 - 3 million Feyli (Shia) Kurds. But what about other non-Feyli Kurds who live Baghdad?
Like I said, South Kurdistan ( + Iraq) 7 - 8 million Kurds (Sorani, Kakai, Badini etc.) + 700.000-800.000 Ezdi Kurds (Shengal, Dohuk, Shekhan, Baghdad etc.) + more than 3 million Feyli Kurds (live mostly in Baghdad). so there're maybe even more than 10 million ethnic Kurds only in the whole Iraq.
There're also much more Kurds in Northern Kurdistan. In few decades if Turkey would exist there would be more Kurds than Turks in Turkey. In whole Turkey live 78 million people. In 20-30 years time there would be at last 40 milion Kurds (+Zaza) only in Turkey.
Today, at least 25-30% are Kurmanji Kurds and 7% Zaza Kurds in Turkey.
10 million Iraq (included Ezdi, Feyli from Baghdad, Kakai)
10 - 11 million Iran (included Feyli)
3 - 4 million Syria (included Ezdi etc.)
25 - 30 million Turkey (included Zaza)
4 million diaspora (included Ezdi, Zaza etc.)
Like I said, South Kurdistan ( + Iraq) 7 - 8 million Kurds (Sorani, Kakai, Badini etc.) + 700.000-800.000 Ezdi Kurds (Shengal, Dohuk, Shekhan, Baghdad etc.) + more than 3 million Feyli Kurds (live mostly in Baghdad). so there're maybe even more than 10 million ethnic Kurds only in the whole Iraq.
There're also much more Kurds in Northern Kurdistan. In few decades if Turkey would exist there would be more Kurds than Turks in Turkey. In whole Turkey live 78 million people. In 20-30 years time there would be at last 40 milion Kurds (+Zaza) only in Turkey.
Today, at least 25-30% are Kurmanji Kurds and 7% Zaza Kurds in Turkey.
10 million Iraq (included Ezdi, Feyli from Baghdad, Kakai)
10 - 11 million Iran (included Feyli)
3 - 4 million Syria (included Ezdi etc.)
25 - 30 million Turkey (included Zaza)
4 million diaspora (included Ezdi, Zaza etc.)
Boreas
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Yazidi and Zaza nationalism are also growing.
YEZIDI NA KURDINA
and now what every pro-kurdish says, Zaza language is consider as in different language group.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zaza_nationalism
YEZIDI NA KURDINA
and now what every pro-kurdish says, Zaza language is consider as in different language group.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zaza_nationalism
Alan
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In no way are there 2-3 mio Kurds in Baghdad. Ask Munir, it's around the hundred thousands. In KRG are currently 5-5.5 mio Kurds, the rest are situated outside, maybe the numbers are even 6.5 mio in total.
Alan
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Yep in your racist divide and conquer mindset. Just once again you display the clear characteristics of an racist Turkish individual I have come across in my lifetime.
Zaza Nationalism is only practized by a very small unorginzed group in Europe. And oh dear have you no idea once again whatsoever. A ethnicity is not only defined by the language, yet Zazaki is by some linguists considered as Kurdish by other as a sibling to Kurdish. Ethnically no one even dared to consider them as something different.
Take in mind some of the biggest Kurdish nationalists and uprisings have started from them. Most of them don't even call themselves Zaza and consider that as an insult, but I don't expect a half informed individual like you are to know this.
Demirtas is a Dimli aka "Zaza", Baydemir is too, Seyit Rize was one and so was Sheyh Said too.
And those videos of Yazidi Nationalists are fake made by desperate Iraqis. I have yet to come across a real Yezidi thinking that way. I have seen Yezidis saying Kurds are Yezidis.
Laz Nationalism is also rising isn't it? Just using your "logic"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rhviDNQWc-8
By the way , just a question when have you done your DNA test?