Politics French elections

Angela

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Any ideas about this split? Are there more Muslims in the eastern areas?

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There are more muslims in the east, specifically the areas around the Mediterranean, the south east alpine region, Alsace and the North east near Belgium. The association is clear, only in the capital region is this association broken between amount of muslims and FN support.

The areas that voted for Macron are the same areas that supported Hollande which makes sense since Macron was formerly a member of the socialiste party.

I would post some images to help you visualize this, but I can never seem to get it to work.
 
There are more muslims in the east, specifically the areas around the Mediterranean, the south east alpine region, Alsace and the North east near Belgium. The association is clear, only in the capital region is this association broken between amount of muslims and FN support.

The areas that voted for Macron are the same areas that supported Hollande which makes sense since Macron was formerly a member of the socialiste party.

I would post some images to help you visualize this, but I can never seem to get it to work.

That's what I thought based on what I know of Marseilles, Provence etc. You also have to understand how this works in a societal context; it's usually areas with high "minority" percentages where you find the greatest tension. Instead, people on the net were coming up either with fanciful explanations or were stymied.
 
There are more muslims in the east, specifically the areas around the Mediterranean, the south east alpine region, Alsace and the North east near Belgium. The association is clear, only in the capital region is this association broken between amount of muslims and FN support.

The areas that voted for Macron are the same areas that supported Hollande which makes sense since Macron was formerly a member of the socialiste party.

I would post some images to help you visualize this, but I can never seem to get it to work.

Macron needs to change wife. With the grandma he has on his side will be a but of the jokes. In the age she is now must take a lot of pills, and smell old age unless she has a liter of parfume.
 
Any ideas about this split? Are there more Muslims in the eastern areas?

1492980256483400.jpg

Macron’s dominance in the Paris region, known as Ile-de-France and home to over 12 million people, means he swept seven of the eight most-populated departments in France. That’s not to say that Le Pen only has rural support. She ultimately won departments that cover half of France’s 10 largest cities: Marseille, Nice, Strasbourg (home of the European Parliament, where she’s been a member since 2004), Montpellier and Lille.

Muslims like to reside in large cities, and they have to be able to survive. Paris is expensive, so the other options are all those listed about who have strong supporters for Le Pen.

Thousands of Iraqi refugees who arrived in Finland in 2015 decided to cancel their asylum applications and to return home voluntarily. Many of the refugees cited family issues and disappointment with life in the frosty Nordic country for the reason they headed home.

By contrast, the Muslims love France, when they come into the country they come in from the East or the South East. The arrival of Muslim immigrants has caused discomfort for the French. The Muslims love the French, but the question is, do the French feel the same way about them?
 
That's what I thought based on what I know of Marseilles, Provence etc. You also have to understand how this works in a societal context; it's usually areas with high "minority" percentages where you find the greatest tension. Instead, people on the net were coming up either with fanciful explanations or were stymied.

I saw the demographic breakdown of the election in a news article. I should have saved it, but I remember some of what it said:

"Blue Collar" and "White collar" workers preferred Le Pen, "Professionals" preferred Macron.

The two higher income brackets also preferred Macron while the two lower income brackets voted for Le Pen.

There was a clear age distinction. Older voters avoided voting for FN like the plague, the memory of her father is still enough to dissuade them. I believe Melanchon also led a few categories, with the youngest demographic and the unemployed but I'm not entirely sure.



I think it's clear Macron represents those who are more well off and Le Pen represents those who are dissatisfied with their situation or current trends in France. This might mean more Melenchon voters will vote for Le Pen especially since she has stepped down from her position in the FN. Macron clearly wins Hamon's constituency.

For supporters of Fillon I'm less sure. Among the upper middle class there is now a predisposition for socially "progressive" values and centre right economics. It will really depend on whether economics or social issues matter more to Fillon's supporters since they are more conservative upper class and Fillon was seen as the conservative side of the Republicans. Fillon of course has endorsed Macron, despite his social stances there was no way Fillon wouldn't support the pro EU candidate. Some of Fillons supporters did not take this well, but perhaps they are just a vocal minority.

A third of french voters are still undecided
 
Well, retirees and high-earners voted overwhelmingly for Macron.

Emmanuel Macron has largely benefited from the vote of people over 65 and retirees as he achieves his best score in this age group. According to the results of the survey, 27% have voted for the candidate of En marche, even though the elderly people still largely voted for François Fillon (41%).

The former Minister of Economy comes second (21%) in the 18-24 years behind Jean-Luc Mélenchon (27%) and on a par with Marine Le Pen. Finally, men are more likely to have voted for Emmanuel Macron (25%) than women (22%).

In the socio-professional categories, the CSP + have largely voted for Macron (32%, especially among executives with 39%) followed by intermediate professions and PSCs. The inactive (including retirees), they are 24% to have voted for Macron.

Unsurprisingly, the highest incomes (more than 3,500 euros monthly) also voted for the former deputy secretary general of the Elysée (36%) far ahead of Fillon (26%). Of the 11 candidates, Macron scored the highest score in this category.

The former business banker also benefited from the vote of the left-wing sympathizers (29%) and especially those of the Socialist Party (48%). These results are far from the votes of Benoît Hamon.

The latter benefited little from the bulletin of the left-wing sympathizers (15%) marking a real break with the previous Socialist presidential candidates. Finally, Macron was able to count on the vote of nearly one out of two voters of François Hollande in 2012 (45%), supporters of the MoDem of Bayrou (64%) and 16% of the voters of Nicolas Sarkozy.

Unlike Emmanuel Macron, Marine Le Pen achieved its worst score among those over 65 (12%). On the other hand, the president of the FN received support from the 25-34 age group (26%) and the 35-49 age group (27%). The youngest (18-24 years) also supported the MEP (21%). On the gender side, perfect equality: 22% of women and 22% of men voted for the candidate of the National Front.

Unlike the candidate of En marche !, Marine Le Pen achieved its best scores in the lower social categories (37% and particularly among workers 45%) followed by intermediate professions (17%) and CSP + (10% ).
 
chomage-par-departement-Q4-2013-e1402329551370.png

A map showing unemployment (chômage) by département for Q4 2013.

The consensus among academics is that there is some correlation between high unemployment and the electoral support for the FN. The persistence of high levels of unemployment is the direct cause of Le Pen's party's rise in deprived areas and FN voters are less likely to have school-leaving certificates, making them more vulnerable to economic downturns.

European-Parl-election-2014-FN-vote-e1402316660978.png

FN vote percentages in the 2014 European parliament election.


There is also the east-west dichotomy in wealth and the western regions which strongly supported Macron are much wealthier than the eastern regions in terms of GDP. To make matters worse, France is facing its highest rates of poverty since 1997 as unemployment climbs to record levels. This voting block suffered most from the EU's austerity measures and Le Pen is willing to take France out of the EU, which is one of the reasons why she's popular.


1390912518_Poverty.map.France.Nouvel.Obs.jpg

Poverty rates in France
 
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By contrast, the Muslims love France, when they come into the country they come in from the East or the South East. The arrival of Muslim immigrants has caused discomfort for the French. The Muslims love the French, but the question is, do the French feel the same way about them?

I'm not really sure what you're getting at here. Maybe you'd like to ask the native French victims of terrorism who have been living in the territory of France for the last 20,000 years. A little hypocritical yourself no? Even you don't consider yourself French, and identify as "Chiwanese" yet you live on their land. Let's see how China or Taiwan would feel if 10,000's of white immigrants moved to your land and refused to assimilate to Chinese customs that had been thousands of years in development.
 
I'm not really sure what you're getting at here. Maybe you'd like to ask the native French victims of terrorism who have been living in the territory of France for the last 20,000 years. A little hypocritical yourself no? Even you don't consider yourself French, and identify as "Chiwanese" yet you live on their land. Let's see how China or Taiwan would feel if 10,000's of white immigrants moved to your land and refused to assimilate to Chinese customs that had been thousands of years in development.

I totally have no idea what are you talking about? The French in those area voted for Le pen because of many reasons. One of the major reasons they did that is that the Muslims do not integrate in their country. There have been 21 deadly Islamist attacks in France since Charlie Hebdo. Many Muslims enter into France from those regions who voted for Le Pen. I was answering Angela's question.

I live in France because I am married to a Frenchman therefore I am French. I have a French degree and I have a job. And what does that have anything to do with what you’ve just said about hypothetically white people migrate to China or Taiwan and do not integrate? How many white/ Chinese marriages do you expect will happen in a country? What is your point? When did I say that I do not consider myself French, I have a French Flag. Chiwanese is my origins and I considered myself a citizen of the world because I have lived all over the world! I was not born neither in Taiwan or China and had never lived in any of those two countries.

It is clearly written on my profile my ethnic is Chiwanese. Can you read?

I am a hypocrite?! I think you are basing your assumptions on ignorance! You think you understand the French better than me?! I have lived in France for more than 10 years? Have you?

I know plenty native French people, how many native French people do you know? Ask them what? Did I say the things you accused me of saying?
 
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chomage-par-departement-Q4-2013-e1402329551370.png

A map showing unemployment (chômage) by département for Q4 2013.

The consensus among academics is that there is some correlation between high unemployment and the electoral support for the FN. The persistence of high levels of unemployment is the direct cause of Le Pen's party's rise in deprived areas and FN voters are less likely to have school-leaving certificates, making them more vulnerable to economic downturns.

European-Parl-election-2014-FN-vote-e1402316660978.png

FN vote percentages in the 2014 European parliament election.


There is also the east-west dichotomy in wealth and the eastern regions which supported Macron are much wealthier than the western regions in terms of GDP. To make matters worse, France is facing its highest rates of poverty since 1997 as unemployment climbs to record levels.

1390912518_Poverty.map.France.Nouvel.Obs.jpg

Poverty rates in France

Oui, Ipsos says that 32% of voters who live in a household with less than 1250 euros of monthly income voted for the National Front, ahead of Jean-Luc Mélenchon (25%). The working class French of 45% opt for Le Pen, ahead of Jean-Luc Mélenchon (21%).

This is contradictory of what Maciamo told us in this thread:
http://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...s-in-and-around-Europe?highlight=unemployment
 
it is the same all over Europe and in the US : the political establishment has lost

in june there are parliamentary elections, which is still in the hands of the political establishment
if Macron doesn't find any support there, he might end in the same situation like Trump in the US

by the way, the result of the elections was as predicted by the polls, no surprise this time
I'm shocked though by the result of number 4, Melenchon, a Trotskist living in utopia who would lead France into bankrupcty in a very short time
 
By contrast, the Muslims love France, when they come into the country they come in from the East or the South East. The arrival of Muslim immigrants has caused discomfort for the French. The Muslims love the French, but the question is, do the French feel the same way about them?

Muslims may love France but I really don't think they love the French. French lifestyle and culture this the antithesis of how a good Muslim should live. They are sexually liberated, irreligious, drink wine and eat pork sausages. That's why the tensions run so deeply. The hate and intolerance is mutual. The French orange just afraid of Muslim terrorist. They have experienced Muslim youths burning thousands of cars, verbally or physically assaulting them in the street, and threatening to destroy their liberal values by imposing Sharia law in the country. There is no love either way between the two parties.

Le Pen's mistake was to take an anti-EU stance. If she had been more mainstream for the economy, she could have been elected president. What French people want is someone who will improve the economy and get rid of the Muslims. Le Pen is just not credible for the economy. That's her main weakness.
 
Muslims may love France but I really don't think they love the French. French lifestyle and culture this the antithesis of how a good Muslim should live. They are sexually liberated, irreligious, drink wine and eat pork sausages. That's why the tensions run so deeply. The hate and intolerance is mutual. The French orange just afraid of Muslim terrorist. They have experienced Muslim youths burning thousands of cars, verbally or physically assaulting them in the street, and threatening to destroy their liberal values by imposing Sharia law in the country. There is no love either way between the two parties.

Le Pen's mistake was to take an anti-EU stance. If she had been more mainstream for the economy, she could have been elected president. What French people want is someone who will improve the economy and get rid of the Muslims. Le Pen is just not credible for the economy. That's her main weakness.

I spoke to my husband about the French election. He thinks the Muslims love the French system not the French. The French system is too generous. They all want to come to France and get a piece of that.

Well, I think it is not completely like that.

I know for a fact that there are some Muslims in France and in Belgium; on the surface they are Muslims, and they insist on their religions and their culture while residing in France or Belgium. However behind closed doors they have sex with French or Belgium men. Yet, to get married that would pose a problem with their families so they ended up breaking up. Now, my question is would you have sex with people you don’t like? Especially with women who come from an upbringing of a modest culture.

I also have some half French half Moroccan or Algerian friends. Their parents are no longer together, and they have no religion. They think they are French and they see themselves as French. So in these situations, their parents were together then they broke up. Are you suggesting that these are all white marriages? There are no sentiments all at, they are only doing that for one reason, to access the French system? Nevertheless, the French accept them as French. They say something like no, Arabs are not French but XYZ, his mum is French. He was born here hence he is French.

They also love French fashion and cuisines. French fashion is very sexy. I would not wear those if I were to visit families in Malaysia for example. My parents would complain on my cleavages. Dressing up in low cut dresses is considered as inappropriate behaviour in countries like Malaysia. So, I have to find clothing that hides my figure if I were to visit there.

In Algeria, where my husband went on vacation once, he saw girls in very short dresses, and yet in France they insist of dressing up in a way that nobody can see who they are talking to. That is much more extreme than how I would dress in Malaysia.

I know a Muslim in Malaysia, he is OK to have meals with the Chinese. He drinks beer, as long as you tell him that this is not beer! He eats pork as long as you tell him that these are not pork!

I know another Muslim lady who told me that some Muslims have lived together before they got married.

The Muslims have changed some parts of the French culture to fit their own, instead of eating pork sausages they eat Merguez for example. Muslims eat French cuisines without the pork. They have localised it to fit their own.

Couscous and tarjin are well accepted by the French. So, the French have been influenced by them too.

Personally speaking, I find the Muslims in France are very hypocritical of their own cultures and their identities. I think they love the French and want to become French. However, not all the French like or accept them in return. Their radical Islamic movements and attacks can be seen as their way of fighting back.

So Le Pen becomes the voice of the French who are angry with the Muslims. “If you don’t behave we will elect her and kick all of you out!” The French exclaimed in their recent election. Le Pen wining the first election is a message from the French telling the Muslims how they feel. It had already happened with Grandpa Le Pen back in 2002.

Unfortunately the person in competition with Le Pen this time is from a new party. Unlike Chirac, he does not have enough people in his party. He needs the members in the French government’s approval for his project. If he cannot get that, even if the French people were to vote for him, he would not be able to implement his plan.
 
FRANCE’S far-right presidential hopeful Marine Le Pen says she is temporarily stepping down as head of her National Front party.

LOL

Macron received the backing of French President Francois Hollande in May’s presidential run-off, citing “the risk for our country’s future” if Marine Le Pen won.

Well, she likes to shock us all doesn't she? She kicked her own father out of his own party and now she resigns...

Wait, I did a search in French, I could not find any news like this today. Could this be fake news?
 
Minty, I love french cuisine, and I love sexy women, whatever language they speak, do I therefore love the french?

The traditional Muslim community does not like the french, and Muslims that integrate with the french people are seen as traitors.

Sometimes they are facing racism and discrimination, but often they are raised with the idea that all frenchmen are racist and that the whole french society is against them. They are told that the french will never accept them and that they should stay in their own community. As a matter of facts they are much more racist then the french themselves - generaly speaking.
 
FRANCE’S far-right presidential hopeful Marine Le Pen says she is temporarily stepping down as head of her National Front party.

LOL

Macron received the backing of French President Francois Hollande in May’s presidential run-off, citing “the risk for our country’s future” if Marine Le Pen won.

Well, she likes to shock us all doesn't she? She kicked her own father out of his own party and now she resigns...

Wait, I did a search in French, I could not find any news like this today. Could this be fake news?
The way it is presented in the news, I forgive you for thinking that Le Pen actually resigned from her party. But that is not what happened. She just resigned as party president, to dedicate herself fully to her role of presidential candidate for France. But she of course still belongs to the Front National Party. Elected French presidents traditionally resign as party leader. That's just a PR stunt to give the impression that she's confident enough that she will win the election. If she loses, she would of course get back control of her own party.
 
I spoke to my husband about the French election. He thinks the Muslims love the French system not the French. The French system is too generous. They all want to come to France and get a piece of that.

I agree with your husband.

I know for a fact that there are some Muslims in France and in Belgium; on the surface they are Muslims, and they insist on their religions and their culture while residing in France or Belgium. However behind closed doors they have sex with French or Belgium men. Yet, to get married that would pose a problem with their families so they ended up breaking up. Now, my question is would you have sex with people you don’t like? Especially with women who come from an upbringing of a modest culture.

I also have some half French half Moroccan or Algerian friends. Their parents are no longer together, and they have no religion. They think they are French and they see themselves as French. So in these situations, their parents were together then they broke up. Are you suggesting that these are all white marriages? There are no sentiments all at, they are only doing that for one reason, to access the French system? Nevertheless, the French accept them as French. They say something like no, Arabs are not French but XYZ, his mum is French. He was born here hence he is French.

They also love French fashion and cuisines. French fashion is very sexy. I would not wear those if I were to visit families in Malaysia for example. My parents would complain on my cleavages. Dressing up in low cut dresses is considered as inappropriate behaviour in countries like Malaysia. So, I have to find clothing that hides my figure if I were to visit there.

In Algeria, where my husband went on vacation once, he saw girls in very short dresses, and yet in France they insist of dressing up in a way that nobody can see who they are talking to. That is much more extreme than how I would dress in Malaysia.

I know a Muslim in Malaysia, he is OK to have meals with the Chinese. He drinks beer, as long as you tell him that this is not beer! He eats pork as long as you tell him that these are not pork!

I know another Muslim lady who told me that some Muslims have lived together before they got married.

There are always exceptions of course. But as you said yourself some of these Muslims are not Muslim anymore and have no religion. French Muslims having sex or marrying non-Muslims is still quite rare and not at all accepted in the Muslim Community.


The Muslims have changed some parts of the French culture to fit their own, instead of eating pork sausages they eat Merguez for example. Muslims eat French cuisines without the pork. They have localised it to fit their own.

Merguez is not French cuisine, it is a Maghrebin import. With the hundreds kinds of pork cured meats in France not just sausages, but ham, salami, saucisson and the like, you cannot fully appreciate French cuisine by cutting out the pork. It's the same for German, Belgian, Austrian, Swiss and North Italian cuisines. Britain and Ireland may be higher on beef, but all these countries have a long tradition of pork products.
 
Minty, I love french cuisine, and I love sexy women, whatever language they speak, do I therefore love the french?

The traditional Muslim community does not like the french, and Muslims that integrate with the french people are seen as traitors.

Sometimes they are facing racism and discrimination, but often they are raised with the idea that all frenchmen are racist and that the whole french society is against them. They are told that the french will never accept them and that they should stay in their own community. As a matter of facts they are much more racist then the french themselves - generaly speaking.

Is French cuisine the only thing you love about France? If so, no, you don’t. You only love their food! If you love any sexy women no matter what language(s) they speak, that to me, just means you are a straight man.

It is just that the Muslims have their preferences which European countries they want to go. France is one of the most popular one. When people are such a big fan of France, (providing they don’t have any bad intentions) I think they love France. They can’t all have bad intentions!

When I was a student in France, I met a bunch of French guys who were obsessed with Japan. They try to say that Japanese women aren’t the reason of their obsession, but it is. There are other things too, about Japan that they love, their culture and their languages and their foods that attract a lot of westerners.

As a Chiwanese ethnic minority I always felt under the shadow. Many French people and other Europeans have really trouble to make the difference between East Asians and would sometimes say things to hurt your feelings. I dare to say, I suffer a lot when it comes to people’s ignorance.

They would expect any East Asian/white relationships to be the same, but in fact it is not. I would never generalise dating a French man to an English man. I knew the two do not necessarily like each other and definitely are not the same. Any man who finds me attractive and only sees my physical outlook and not the person inside my body are just well….not ok. There have been a lot of those. They forgot there are lots of reasons other than physical attraction would work as a couple. I think they were just trying to score.

Perhaps for some they can date any women they find attractive, but for me aside from that, the man has to be somebody who fits into the life I had work so hard to achieve. Judging from this, you could say that I love France. I made all this effort to integrate into the Francophone societies, for love.

You mentioned about the Arabs who chose to integrate that were seen as traitors. I had been called that too by Chinese men because I am full blooded Han and I married a white man. I only have a small amount of Chinese girlfriends left, plus my family. The rest of my friends are quite diverse and not Chinese.

Now, I also met other Asians who love France. Not a lot, but there were some. Not all of them stay in France because not all of them found a French spouse and not all of them found a job. Perhaps some of them are like what my husband said about the Muslims who are just here to scam the French system, but others I think love France and the French. Unfortunately for them, the French do not feel the same way.

If you like a lot of things about France, their food, language, system, and you chose it above all other choices in the world. My impression is you love the French and France. It is not as if though you can be happy living in France without the French.

Having said that, yes there are those who come to France just for the passport, and those spies being sent here to destroy France. For these reasons, the French do not trust foreigners. It is like what I said in the other thread: : It is easy to understand racism. It is almost tribal. You like to be amongst the people who are like you. When you don’t know them, you are afraid, and that is all a part of ignorance.

Yeah, brainwashing from their own community is another reason why they won't stop attacking westerners everywhere, not just the French. However some western countries have been targeted more often than others.
 

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