G25 imperial Greek shift in Greeks and Italians + a comparison with qpAdm

Well, it's not a big stretch, history is full of migratory patterns. Macedonia with Alexander expanded to the East and created Helleno-Persian syncretisms (Seleucids), Helleno-Egyptian (Ptolemy), Helleno-Bactrian, etc.

Europe is currently undergoing severe demographic changes, almost to the point of what you'd call 'replacement'. Just google the projections for the next ten to twenty years.

Greece and the Balkans (with minor exceptions) are no better, local population growth has stagnated and collapsed.
'
Greece in 20 years max will be a very different population to now, that's the timeframe of a generational span (30 years).

When the Slavs descended into the penninsula and occupied the space in the 7th century, there were few (if any) to stop them, constant conflict, plague, etc, in the ERE made such an endeavor impossible.

Now you have diaspora 'mainland Greeks' with Slavic I2a-din haplos questioning the validity of Anatolian admixture of the Hellenistic times when themselves are the products of such 'replacement' lineages.
 
All of this is so dumb, C6 existed in the same time as C5!

C6 outlasted C5, and is shown to have become the dominate group after the middle ages.

Modern Central and Southern Italians are predominately C6.

This is why Umbria, Lazio, and Marche are part of the Southern Italian cluster in Raveane et. al 2019. Because it was C6 people that repopulated medieval Rome. That is the main component that is shared by central and southern Italians.

They're northern-shifted southerners; they're (C6) that mixed are on a gradient to C7, which is brought by Northern Italian influence, as well as influence from north of the Alps.

South Italians are also predominately (C6) on a gradient to C5, which like has more to do with the Greek colonies. I recall Sarno et. al. 2021 on Calabrian Greeks.

Northern Italians are also on a gradient between C7 and C6, they too must have ancestry related to non-Etruscan, pre-Italic people. But they probably have more Italic/Etruscan-like ancestry perhaps, along with a small but notable contribution from north of the Alps.

It is all very simple actually.

To my knowledge there has never been a study done on the Apennine culture of central and southern Italy. This Bronze Age culture lasted between 1500 to 1400 BC. I think these people will be mostly C6-like.
 
Last edited:
To my knowledge there has never been a study done on the Apennine culture of central and southern Italy. This Bronze Age culture lasted between 800 to 1200 BC. I think these people will be mostly C6-like.

In my opinion a C6 cluster appears in Italy only with Iron age Greek colonization, I think the appennine culture (assuming they were pre-indoeuropean) would look more like late bronze age Sicily or Sicanian (wich already show CHG/Iran_N admixture, but to a lesser extent). But I may very well be wrong.
 
In my opinion a C6 cluster appears in Italy only with Iron age Greek colonization, I think the appennine culture (assuming they were pre-indoeuropean) would look more like late bronze age Sicily or Sicanian (wich already show CHG/Iran_N admixture, but to a lesser extent). But I may very well be wrong.

My thinking is simple: If you increase the Republican Italic admixture to a considerable extend in samples which are overlapping or plot east of the Cypriot average you get a C5/C6 cluster. But that is only my opinion I could be wrong about that.
366-708-f2.jpg
 
To my knowledge there has never been a study done on the Apennine culture of central and southern Italy. This Bronze Age culture lasted between 800 to 1200 BC. I think these people will be mostly C6-like.

Code:
[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]GCP003:Italy_1608BCE–1504BCE-ReginaMargherita[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A3FF00, align: right"]4.79398582[/TD]
[TD]C7-Cancelleria_MA:R1289:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BFFF00, align: right"]5.60889472[/TD]
[TD]TAQ008:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CCFF00, align: right"]6.01098162[/TD]
[TD]I2469:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #D1FF00, align: right"]6.14709688[/TD]
[TD]SE_Iberia_c5-8CE:I3584:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #D5FF00, align: right"]6.25496603[/TD]
[TD]I1313:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DBFF00, align: right"]6.44734054[/TD]
[TD]I10892:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E4FF00, align: right"]6.69151702[/TD]
[TD]I1977:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E5FF00, align: right"]6.72177804[/TD]
[TD]Crusader_Pit:SI40:Haber_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #EDFF00, align: right"]6.97063842[/TD]
[TD]Mallorca_EBA_Cova_des_Moro:I4329:Fernandes_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F4FF00, align: right"]7.16732168[/TD]
[TD]Beaker_Northern_Italy:I2478:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F9FF00, align: right"]7.33263936[/TD]
[TD]Prenestini_IA:R435:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FBFF00, align: right"]7.37455083[/TD]
[TD]Wartau_(CH):SX18:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFFC00, align: right"]7.57436466[/TD]
[TD]Beaker_Central_Europe:I6534:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFFB00, align: right"]7.60896839[/TD]
[TD]TAQ017:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFFA00, align: right"]7.63374744[/TD]
[TD]TAQ004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF700, align: right"]7.72710166[/TD]
[TD]Beaker_Central_Europe:I6581:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF700, align: right"]7.74657344[/TD]
[TD]TAQ016:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF500, align: right"]7.79111032[/TD]
[TD]TAQ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF200, align: right"]7.88620314[/TD]
[TD]France_LBA:NIED:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF100, align: right"]7.90216426[/TD]
[TD]CSN013:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFE600, align: right"]8.24897569[/TD]
[TD]CAM003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFE300, align: right"]8.31291766[/TD]
[TD]utigBRC007_019:Saupe_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFE300, align: right"]8.32222326[/TD]
[TD]CSN003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFE300, align: right"]8.33701385[/TD]
[TD]NE_Iberia_c6-8CE_ES:I7675:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFE100, align: right"]8.37964796[/TD]
[TD]BRC003_Dodecad_K12b[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Code:
[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]R11107_Italy_1923BCE-1614BCE-Pian_Sultano[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #5EFF00, align: right"]2.76289703[/TD]
[TD]CAM003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #61FF00, align: right"]2.85790133[/TD]
[TD]Sicily_EBA_Isnello:I8561:Fernandes_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #63FF00, align: right"]2.91614472[/TD]
[TD]E_Iberia_IA:I12640:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #6EFF00, align: right"]3.22068316[/TD]
[TD]I3491:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #81FF00, align: right"]3.79427200[/TD]
[TD]TAQ004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #82FF00, align: right"]3.82729670[/TD]
[TD]CSN003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8AFF00, align: right"]4.05376368[/TD]
[TD]VET007:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8CFF00, align: right"]4.12213537[/TD]
[TD]Balkans_N:I1297:Mathieson_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #96FF00, align: right"]4.41552941[/TD]
[TD]CAM001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #98FF00, align: right"]4.45987668[/TD]
[TD]PRZ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #99FF00, align: right"]4.49345079[/TD]
[TD]I3594:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A4FF00, align: right"]4.83807813[/TD]
[TD]TAQ019:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #ACFF00, align: right"]5.06088925[/TD]
[TD]CSN004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B4FF00, align: right"]5.29104905[/TD]
[TD]Oberbipp_Horgen_(CH):MX299:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B8FF00, align: right"]5.41939111[/TD]
[TD]I7045:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B8FF00, align: right"]5.42323704[/TD]
[TD]BRC003_Dodecad_K12b[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B9FF00, align: right"]5.42657350[/TD]
[TD]TAQ010:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BAFF00, align: right"]5.46133683[/TD]
[TD]Vatya:RISE247:Allentoft_2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BCFF00, align: right"]5.53882659[/TD]
[TD]TAQ016:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C1FF00, align: right"]5.67909324[/TD]
[TD]Etruscan_IA:R473:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C4FF00, align: right"]5.77364703[/TD]
[TD]CSN001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CBFF00, align: right"]5.96088081[/TD]
[TD]TAQ008:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CCFF00, align: right"]5.99533152[/TD]
[TD]TAQ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CCFF00, align: right"]6.00847734[/TD]
[TD]ROS102:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CDFF00, align: right"]6.03872503[/TD]
[TD]TAQ018:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Code:
[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]R11105_Italy_1735BCE-1615BCE-Pian_Sultano[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #5CFF00, align: right"]2.71948525[/TD]
[TD]E_Iberia_IA:I12640:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #6CFF00, align: right"]3.17198676[/TD]
[TD]CAM003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #76FF00, align: right"]3.46026011[/TD]
[TD]TAQ004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #81FF00, align: right"]3.78773019[/TD]
[TD]Sicily_EBA_Isnello:I8561:Fernandes_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #93FF00, align: right"]4.32013889[/TD]
[TD]PRZ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #95FF00, align: right"]4.37715661[/TD]
[TD]Balkans_N:I1297:Mathieson_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #96FF00, align: right"]4.41052151[/TD]
[TD]I3491:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #97FF00, align: right"]4.44130611[/TD]
[TD]TAQ008:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9FFF00, align: right"]4.67479411[/TD]
[TD]CSN003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9FFF00, align: right"]4.69007463[/TD]
[TD]CAM001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A4FF00, align: right"]4.83676545[/TD]
[TD]Wartau_(CH):SX18:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A5FF00, align: right"]4.86740177[/TD]
[TD]I3594:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A9FF00, align: right"]4.96091725[/TD]
[TD]Vatya:RISE247:Allentoft_2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #AEFF00, align: right"]5.11944333[/TD]
[TD]VET007:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #AFFF00, align: right"]5.13853092[/TD]
[TD]CSN004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B2FF00, align: right"]5.23183524[/TD]
[TD]TAQ016:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B2FF00, align: right"]5.24727548[/TD]
[TD]I1977:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B6FF00, align: right"]5.34682149[/TD]
[TD]TAQ019:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BBFF00, align: right"]5.51161501[/TD]
[TD]Oberbipp_Horgen_(CH):MX299:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BCFF00, align: right"]5.53631646[/TD]
[TD]BRC003_Dodecad_K12b[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C0FF00, align: right"]5.65772039[/TD]
[TD]TAQ010:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CBFF00, align: right"]5.97970735[/TD]
[TD]TAQ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CDFF00, align: right"]6.04148988[/TD]
[TD]Etruscan_IA:R473:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CFFF00, align: right"]6.08081409[/TD]
[TD]TAQ017:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #D0FF00, align: right"]6.13100318[/TD]
[TD]Latini_IA:R851:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Code:
[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]R11104_Italy_1923BCE-1614BCE-Pian_Sultano[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #2EFF00, align: right"]1.36275456[/TD]
[TD]TAQ004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #48FF00, align: right"]2.10829315[/TD]
[TD]I3594:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #4AFF00, align: right"]2.16827120[/TD]
[TD]TAQ016:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #56FF00, align: right"]2.53426518[/TD]
[TD]PRZ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #58FF00, align: right"]2.57947669[/TD]
[TD]BRC003_Dodecad_K12b[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #59FF00, align: right"]2.62806012[/TD]
[TD]CAM001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #5AFF00, align: right"]2.65849582[/TD]
[TD]TAQ019:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #65FF00, align: right"]2.95658587[/TD]
[TD]Wartau_(CH):SX18:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #68FF00, align: right"]3.06101290[/TD]
[TD]Oberbipp_Horgen_(CH):MX299:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #68FF00, align: right"]3.06685507[/TD]
[TD]CAM003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #71FF00, align: right"]3.32493609[/TD]
[TD]TAQ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #75FF00, align: right"]3.44251362[/TD]
[TD]TAQ010:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #81FF00, align: right"]3.79338899[/TD]
[TD]CSN001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #86FF00, align: right"]3.93021628[/TD]
[TD]CSN006:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8AFF00, align: right"]4.04913571[/TD]
[TD]Etruscan_IA:R473:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8FFF00, align: right"]4.20569852[/TD]
[TD]TAQ008:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #92FF00, align: right"]4.30098826[/TD]
[TD]Latini_IA:R851:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #94FF00, align: right"]4.34009216[/TD]
[TD]Villanovan_IA:R1015:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #94FF00, align: right"]4.35997706[/TD]
[TD]TAQ015:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #95FF00, align: right"]4.38476909[/TD]
[TD]utigBRC002:Saupe_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #96FF00, align: right"]4.41839337[/TD]
[TD]I7045:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #97FF00, align: right"]4.45226908[/TD]
[TD]PRZ002:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9DFF00, align: right"]4.61835469[/TD]
[TD]TAQ002:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A0FF00, align: right"]4.69533811[/TD]
[TD]Sicily_EBA_Isnello:I8561:Fernandes_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A2FF00, align: right"]4.76866858[/TD]
[TD]TAQ024:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Code:
[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]R11102_Italy_1923BCE-1770BCE-Pian_Sultano[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A7FF00, align: right"]4.89776480[/TD]
[TD]I6468:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A8FF00, align: right"]4.95532037[/TD]
[TD]Maros:RISE373:Allentoft_2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B7FF00, align: right"]5.38548976[/TD]
[TD]Hallstatt_C-Early_La_Tène_IA:NOR4:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B8FF00, align: right"]5.40336932[/TD]
[TD]Germany_BA_Untermeitingen:RISE471:Allentoft_2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C2FF00, align: right"]5.71627501[/TD]
[TD]France_EBA:PSS4170:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #D6FF00, align: right"]6.29744393[/TD]
[TD]Malak_Preslavets:I1108:Mathieson_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DAFF00, align: right"]6.41242544[/TD]
[TD]Wartau_(CH):SX20:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DAFF00, align: right"]6.41908093[/TD]
[TD]I3758:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DEFF00, align: right"]6.53531178[/TD]
[TD]Vatya:RISE254:Allentoft_2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E1FF00, align: right"]6.60325677[/TD]
[TD]I12034:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E3FF00, align: right"]6.66520067[/TD]
[TD]NE_Iberia_c6-8CE_ES:I3775:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E3FF00, align: right"]6.68700980[/TD]
[TD]I12879:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E5FF00, align: right"]6.72433640[/TD]
[TD]Balkans_N:I1113:Mathieson_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E8FF00, align: right"]6.82033724[/TD]
[TD]I12171:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E8FF00, align: right"]6.83077594[/TD]
[TD]Singen_(D):MX256:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #EBFF00, align: right"]6.90195624[/TD]
[TD]France_EBA:EUG11:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #EDFF00, align: right"]6.96257136[/TD]
[TD]I8203:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #EEFF00, align: right"]6.99066520[/TD]
[TD]France_EBA:RIX2:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F3FF00, align: right"]7.15356554[/TD]
[TD]NW_Iberia_CA_Stp:I3238:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F4FF00, align: right"]7.16344889[/TD]
[TD]Prenestini_IA:R435:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F7FF00, align: right"]7.26823913[/TD]
[TD]Beaker_Northern_Italy:I2478:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FBFF00, align: right"]7.39421395[/TD]
[TD]I6623:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FDFF00, align: right"]7.42917223[/TD]
[TD]Beaker_Central_Europe:I4252:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF700, align: right"]7.72070593[/TD]
[TD]C7-Isola_Sacra_Necropolis_Imperial_Rome:R37:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF700, align: right"]7.73111247[/TD]
[TD]UDC_P:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


I'm not sure. However, the samples from central Italy during the Early-Middle Bronze Age already appear to resemble C7.
 
To my knowledge there has never been a study done on the Apennine culture of central and southern Italy. This Bronze Age culture lasted between 800 to 1200 BC. I think these people will be mostly C6-like.

i find your dating strange

it should be

1000BC and beyond is bronze-age

800-1000BC is early iron age or as some say, halstatt phase one

500-800BC is middle iron age or as some say, halstatt phase two

under 500BC late iron age or as some say, La Tene culture phase
 
In my opinion a C6 cluster appears in Italy only with Iron age Greek colonization, I think the appennine culture (assuming they were pre-indoeuropean) would look more like late bronze age Sicily or Sicanian (wich already show CHG/Iran_N admixture, but to a lesser extent). But I may very well be wrong.


there are no Greeks in Italy earlier than 750BC .............Corinthian Greeks where the first Greeks to enter
 
My thinking is simple: If you increase the Republican Italic admixture to a considerable extend in samples which are overlapping or plot east of the Cypriot average you get a C5/C6 cluster. But that is only my opinion I could be wrong about that.
366-708-f2.jpg
With such a model you would need quite a lot of people from east of Cyprus though.
 
i find your dating strange
it should be
1000BC and beyond is bronze-age
800-1000BC is early iron age or as some say, halstatt phase one
500-800BC is middle iron age or as some say, halstatt phase two
under 500BC late iron age or as some say, La Tene culture phase

The years were an error on my part, it was between 1500-1300 BC:

The Apennine culture is a technology complex in central and southern Italy from the Italian Middle Bronze Age (15th–14th centuries BC).[1] In the mid-20th century the Apennine was divided into Proto-, Early, Middle and Late sub- phases[1], but now archaeologists prefer to consider as "Apennine" only the ornamental pottery style of the later phase of Middle Bronze Age (BM3). This phase is preceded by the Grotta Nuova facies (central Italy) and by the Protoapennine B facies (southern Italy) and succeeded by the Subapennine facies of 13th-century ("Bronzo Recente"). Apennine pottery is a burnished ware incised with spirals, meanders and geometrical zones, filled with dots or transverse dashes. It has been found on Ischia island in association with LHII and LHIII pottery and on Lipari in association with LHIIIA pottery, which associations date it to the Late Bronze Age as it is defined in Greece and the Aegean.[2]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apennine_culture
 
Code:
[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]GCP003:Italy_1608BCE–1504BCE-ReginaMargherita[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A3FF00, align: right"]4.79398582[/TD]
[TD]C7-Cancelleria_MA:R1289:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BFFF00, align: right"]5.60889472[/TD]
[TD]TAQ008:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CCFF00, align: right"]6.01098162[/TD]
[TD]I2469:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #D1FF00, align: right"]6.14709688[/TD]
[TD]SE_Iberia_c5-8CE:I3584:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #D5FF00, align: right"]6.25496603[/TD]
[TD]I1313:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DBFF00, align: right"]6.44734054[/TD]
[TD]I10892:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E4FF00, align: right"]6.69151702[/TD]
[TD]I1977:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E5FF00, align: right"]6.72177804[/TD]
[TD]Crusader_Pit:SI40:Haber_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #EDFF00, align: right"]6.97063842[/TD]
[TD]Mallorca_EBA_Cova_des_Moro:I4329:Fernandes_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F4FF00, align: right"]7.16732168[/TD]
[TD]Beaker_Northern_Italy:I2478:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F9FF00, align: right"]7.33263936[/TD]
[TD]Prenestini_IA:R435:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FBFF00, align: right"]7.37455083[/TD]
[TD]Wartau_(CH):SX18:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFFC00, align: right"]7.57436466[/TD]
[TD]Beaker_Central_Europe:I6534:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFFB00, align: right"]7.60896839[/TD]
[TD]TAQ017:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFFA00, align: right"]7.63374744[/TD]
[TD]TAQ004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF700, align: right"]7.72710166[/TD]
[TD]Beaker_Central_Europe:I6581:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF700, align: right"]7.74657344[/TD]
[TD]TAQ016:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF500, align: right"]7.79111032[/TD]
[TD]TAQ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF200, align: right"]7.88620314[/TD]
[TD]France_LBA:NIED:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF100, align: right"]7.90216426[/TD]
[TD]CSN013:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFE600, align: right"]8.24897569[/TD]
[TD]CAM003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFE300, align: right"]8.31291766[/TD]
[TD]utigBRC007_019:Saupe_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFE300, align: right"]8.32222326[/TD]
[TD]CSN003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFE300, align: right"]8.33701385[/TD]
[TD]NE_Iberia_c6-8CE_ES:I7675:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFE100, align: right"]8.37964796[/TD]
[TD]BRC003_Dodecad_K12b[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Code:
[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]R11107_Italy_1923BCE-1614BCE-Pian_Sultano[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #5EFF00, align: right"]2.76289703[/TD]
[TD]CAM003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #61FF00, align: right"]2.85790133[/TD]
[TD]Sicily_EBA_Isnello:I8561:Fernandes_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #63FF00, align: right"]2.91614472[/TD]
[TD]E_Iberia_IA:I12640:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #6EFF00, align: right"]3.22068316[/TD]
[TD]I3491:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #81FF00, align: right"]3.79427200[/TD]
[TD]TAQ004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #82FF00, align: right"]3.82729670[/TD]
[TD]CSN003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8AFF00, align: right"]4.05376368[/TD]
[TD]VET007:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8CFF00, align: right"]4.12213537[/TD]
[TD]Balkans_N:I1297:Mathieson_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #96FF00, align: right"]4.41552941[/TD]
[TD]CAM001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #98FF00, align: right"]4.45987668[/TD]
[TD]PRZ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #99FF00, align: right"]4.49345079[/TD]
[TD]I3594:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A4FF00, align: right"]4.83807813[/TD]
[TD]TAQ019:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #ACFF00, align: right"]5.06088925[/TD]
[TD]CSN004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B4FF00, align: right"]5.29104905[/TD]
[TD]Oberbipp_Horgen_(CH):MX299:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B8FF00, align: right"]5.41939111[/TD]
[TD]I7045:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B8FF00, align: right"]5.42323704[/TD]
[TD]BRC003_Dodecad_K12b[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B9FF00, align: right"]5.42657350[/TD]
[TD]TAQ010:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BAFF00, align: right"]5.46133683[/TD]
[TD]Vatya:RISE247:Allentoft_2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BCFF00, align: right"]5.53882659[/TD]
[TD]TAQ016:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C1FF00, align: right"]5.67909324[/TD]
[TD]Etruscan_IA:R473:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C4FF00, align: right"]5.77364703[/TD]
[TD]CSN001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CBFF00, align: right"]5.96088081[/TD]
[TD]TAQ008:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CCFF00, align: right"]5.99533152[/TD]
[TD]TAQ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CCFF00, align: right"]6.00847734[/TD]
[TD]ROS102:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CDFF00, align: right"]6.03872503[/TD]
[TD]TAQ018:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Code:
[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]R11105_Italy_1735BCE-1615BCE-Pian_Sultano[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #5CFF00, align: right"]2.71948525[/TD]
[TD]E_Iberia_IA:I12640:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #6CFF00, align: right"]3.17198676[/TD]
[TD]CAM003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #76FF00, align: right"]3.46026011[/TD]
[TD]TAQ004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #81FF00, align: right"]3.78773019[/TD]
[TD]Sicily_EBA_Isnello:I8561:Fernandes_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #93FF00, align: right"]4.32013889[/TD]
[TD]PRZ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #95FF00, align: right"]4.37715661[/TD]
[TD]Balkans_N:I1297:Mathieson_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #96FF00, align: right"]4.41052151[/TD]
[TD]I3491:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #97FF00, align: right"]4.44130611[/TD]
[TD]TAQ008:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9FFF00, align: right"]4.67479411[/TD]
[TD]CSN003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9FFF00, align: right"]4.69007463[/TD]
[TD]CAM001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A4FF00, align: right"]4.83676545[/TD]
[TD]Wartau_(CH):SX18:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A5FF00, align: right"]4.86740177[/TD]
[TD]I3594:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A9FF00, align: right"]4.96091725[/TD]
[TD]Vatya:RISE247:Allentoft_2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #AEFF00, align: right"]5.11944333[/TD]
[TD]VET007:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #AFFF00, align: right"]5.13853092[/TD]
[TD]CSN004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B2FF00, align: right"]5.23183524[/TD]
[TD]TAQ016:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B2FF00, align: right"]5.24727548[/TD]
[TD]I1977:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B6FF00, align: right"]5.34682149[/TD]
[TD]TAQ019:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BBFF00, align: right"]5.51161501[/TD]
[TD]Oberbipp_Horgen_(CH):MX299:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BCFF00, align: right"]5.53631646[/TD]
[TD]BRC003_Dodecad_K12b[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C0FF00, align: right"]5.65772039[/TD]
[TD]TAQ010:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CBFF00, align: right"]5.97970735[/TD]
[TD]TAQ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CDFF00, align: right"]6.04148988[/TD]
[TD]Etruscan_IA:R473:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CFFF00, align: right"]6.08081409[/TD]
[TD]TAQ017:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #D0FF00, align: right"]6.13100318[/TD]
[TD]Latini_IA:R851:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Code:
[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]R11104_Italy_1923BCE-1614BCE-Pian_Sultano[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #2EFF00, align: right"]1.36275456[/TD]
[TD]TAQ004:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #48FF00, align: right"]2.10829315[/TD]
[TD]I3594:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #4AFF00, align: right"]2.16827120[/TD]
[TD]TAQ016:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #56FF00, align: right"]2.53426518[/TD]
[TD]PRZ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #58FF00, align: right"]2.57947669[/TD]
[TD]BRC003_Dodecad_K12b[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #59FF00, align: right"]2.62806012[/TD]
[TD]CAM001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #5AFF00, align: right"]2.65849582[/TD]
[TD]TAQ019:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #65FF00, align: right"]2.95658587[/TD]
[TD]Wartau_(CH):SX18:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #68FF00, align: right"]3.06101290[/TD]
[TD]Oberbipp_Horgen_(CH):MX299:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #68FF00, align: right"]3.06685507[/TD]
[TD]CAM003:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #71FF00, align: right"]3.32493609[/TD]
[TD]TAQ001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #75FF00, align: right"]3.44251362[/TD]
[TD]TAQ010:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #81FF00, align: right"]3.79338899[/TD]
[TD]CSN001:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #86FF00, align: right"]3.93021628[/TD]
[TD]CSN006:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8AFF00, align: right"]4.04913571[/TD]
[TD]Etruscan_IA:R473:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8FFF00, align: right"]4.20569852[/TD]
[TD]TAQ008:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #92FF00, align: right"]4.30098826[/TD]
[TD]Latini_IA:R851:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #94FF00, align: right"]4.34009216[/TD]
[TD]Villanovan_IA:R1015:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #94FF00, align: right"]4.35997706[/TD]
[TD]TAQ015:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #95FF00, align: right"]4.38476909[/TD]
[TD]utigBRC002:Saupe_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #96FF00, align: right"]4.41839337[/TD]
[TD]I7045:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #97FF00, align: right"]4.45226908[/TD]
[TD]PRZ002:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9DFF00, align: right"]4.61835469[/TD]
[TD]TAQ002:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A0FF00, align: right"]4.69533811[/TD]
[TD]Sicily_EBA_Isnello:I8561:Fernandes_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A2FF00, align: right"]4.76866858[/TD]
[TD]TAQ024:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Code:
[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]R11102_Italy_1923BCE-1770BCE-Pian_Sultano[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A7FF00, align: right"]4.89776480[/TD]
[TD]I6468:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A8FF00, align: right"]4.95532037[/TD]
[TD]Maros:RISE373:Allentoft_2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B7FF00, align: right"]5.38548976[/TD]
[TD]Hallstatt_C-Early_La_Tène_IA:NOR4:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B8FF00, align: right"]5.40336932[/TD]
[TD]Germany_BA_Untermeitingen:RISE471:Allentoft_2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C2FF00, align: right"]5.71627501[/TD]
[TD]France_EBA:PSS4170:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #D6FF00, align: right"]6.29744393[/TD]
[TD]Malak_Preslavets:I1108:Mathieson_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DAFF00, align: right"]6.41242544[/TD]
[TD]Wartau_(CH):SX20:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DAFF00, align: right"]6.41908093[/TD]
[TD]I3758:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DEFF00, align: right"]6.53531178[/TD]
[TD]Vatya:RISE254:Allentoft_2015[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E1FF00, align: right"]6.60325677[/TD]
[TD]I12034:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E3FF00, align: right"]6.66520067[/TD]
[TD]NE_Iberia_c6-8CE_ES:I3775:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E3FF00, align: right"]6.68700980[/TD]
[TD]I12879:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E5FF00, align: right"]6.72433640[/TD]
[TD]Balkans_N:I1113:Mathieson_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E8FF00, align: right"]6.82033724[/TD]
[TD]I12171:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E8FF00, align: right"]6.83077594[/TD]
[TD]Singen_(D):MX256:Furtwängler_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #EBFF00, align: right"]6.90195624[/TD]
[TD]France_EBA:EUG11:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #EDFF00, align: right"]6.96257136[/TD]
[TD]I8203:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #EEFF00, align: right"]6.99066520[/TD]
[TD]France_EBA:RIX2:Brunel_2020[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F3FF00, align: right"]7.15356554[/TD]
[TD]NW_Iberia_CA_Stp:I3238:Olalde_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F4FF00, align: right"]7.16344889[/TD]
[TD]Prenestini_IA:R435:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #F7FF00, align: right"]7.26823913[/TD]
[TD]Beaker_Northern_Italy:I2478:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FBFF00, align: right"]7.39421395[/TD]
[TD]I6623:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FDFF00, align: right"]7.42917223[/TD]
[TD]Beaker_Central_Europe:I4252:Olalde_2018[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF700, align: right"]7.72070593[/TD]
[TD]C7-Isola_Sacra_Necropolis_Imperial_Rome:R37:Antonio_2019[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #FFF700, align: right"]7.73111247[/TD]
[TD]UDC_P:Etruscan_Pre-Print_2021[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


I'm not sure. However, the samples from central Italy during the Early-Middle Bronze Age already appear to resemble C7.

I think it is likely they're C7-C6-like people on a gradient would be more like it. I'd like to see samples from the south in this time.

C6 is pulled in two directions, towards C7 and C5. Central and Southern Italy would probably be pulled in those directions from influences north of the Alps and the EBA Caucasian-enriched Anatolian-like farmers from the Aegean. I Think this is the reason why a two-way analysis of Minoan, and Northwestern European influences is a viable model.

epI5kEs.png
 
Question: What were the material cultures associated with the time frame in question during the bronze age in southern Italy, particularly Apulia?


ChatGPT:


The Bronze Age in Southern Italy, including Apulia (also known as Puglia), spanned from around 2,300 to 1,000 BCE. This period was characterized by the development of several distinct cultures, which are identifiable through their unique styles of pottery, metalwork, and burial practices. Here are some notable examples:


Apennine Culture (1,600-1,150 BCE): This culture, named after the Apennine Mountains, was present throughout Italy during the middle to late Bronze Age. It's known for its characteristic pottery style: small vessels with incised geometric patterns, often in the shape of small animals or humans.


Palma Campania Culture (1,550-1,150 BCE): This culture is known for its characteristic pottery decorated with complex geometric motifs, often in dark colors on a light background.


Proto-Apulian Culture (1,200-850 BCE): This was a local culture in Apulia, which was marked by the emergence of fortified settlements and specialized craftsmanship, particularly in pottery and bronze work. The pottery often had geometric designs and featured human and animal figures.


Please note that these cultures often overlapped and interacted, so the material culture of a given region in this time period would likely reflect influences from multiple sources. Also, the exact dating of these cultures can vary based on different sources or methodologies.


This is a high-level overview, and more specific information may be available from archaeological research or museum collections. If you're interested in a more detailed account of a specific culture or aspect of material culture, let me know and I'll do my best to provide it.
 
Question: are there any ancient DNA samples or theories of where the people of Apennine Culture , Palma Campania Culture, or Proto-Apulian Culture come from? Only use reputable sources, no Wikipedia.

This is magnificent, and highly illuminating!

ChatGPT (With plugins!)

Here's what I found from reputable sources:


1. **Apennine Culture**: The Apennine culture is an archaeological culture of the Middle Bronze Age (c. 1600–1150 BC) in central and southern Italy. The people of the Apennine culture were likely indigenous to the Italian Peninsula, with some influences from the Balkans and the Aegean region. However, there is no definitive evidence from ancient DNA samples to confirm this. The culture is known for its characteristic pottery, known as "impasto ware," and for its construction of megalithic buildings and fortifications. The Apennine culture was succeeded by the Villanovan culture in the Iron Age[^1^].


2. **Palma Campania Culture**: The Palma Campania culture (c. 1800–1500 BC) was a Bronze Age culture in Campania, southern Italy. The culture is known for its distinctive pottery and for its burial practices, which included both inhumation and cremation. The origins of the Palma Campania culture are not well understood, and there is no definitive evidence from ancient DNA samples to confirm any theories. However, it is generally believed that the culture developed locally in Campania, possibly influenced by contacts with the Aegean and the Balkans[^2^].


3. **Proto-Apulian Culture**: The Proto-Apulian culture (c. 1250–1000 BC) was a Late Bronze Age culture in Apulia, southeastern Italy. The culture is known for its characteristic pottery, known as "Proto-Apulian ware," which shows influences from the Mycenaean culture of Greece. The origins of the Proto-Apulian culture are not well understood, and there is no definitive evidence from ancient DNA samples to confirm any theories. However, it is generally believed that the culture developed locally in Apulia, possibly influenced by contacts with the Aegean[^3^].


Please note that these are general summaries and the origins of these cultures are still subjects of ongoing research. More definitive answers may be provided by future archaeological discoveries and advancements in the analysis of ancient DNA.


Sources:
[^1^]: [ResearchGate](https://www.researchgate.net/public...ern_Apennines_Italy_New_data_and_perspectives)
[^2^]: [Cambridge](https://www.cambridge.org/core/jour...-consumption/7D3B9D6456D4AEB9C1F9DF14B3A19A7A)
[^3^]: [Taylor & Francis Online](https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/00438243.1981.9979750)
 
^^Therefore, I stand by my speculation that the people of these cultures could have approximated C6 by the BA in southern Italy.


Archeology shows that cultural influence from the Aegean and the Balkans predates that of Magna Grecia in southern Italy, and I am sure the genetics follows. Every Bronze Age material culture in the south shows it.
 
read and summarize this link: https://www.eupedia.com/forum/threa...n-Greeks-and-Italians-a-comparison-with-qpAdm

ChatGPT:

In the forum thread you provided, the original poster, who identifies as a Greek Cypriot, discusses genetic models and the shifts they indicate in Greek and Italian populations over time. The key points from the discussion are:


The models discussed do not imply direct ancestry but instead show the shifts in genetic patterns over time. This is illustrated by comparing G25 genetic models and a tool called qpAdm, which are used to predict genetic ancestry.


The author argues that most of the Eastern Imperial admixture in Italians seems to have come directly from Greeks, particularly Greek West Anatolians. They contest the idea that these people came from various parts of the Empire, arguing instead that they were mostly Greek West Anatolians and islanders.


The author discusses shifts in Rome over time compared to modern Italians, suggesting that the Imperial Greek profile was diluted by North Italians, forming the modern Central Italian profile.


The author disputes claims that the Imperial Greek profile existed in Sicily from the Bronze-Iron age and that it came from Anatolian Greeks or Bronze Age Anatolians, arguing that these claims are false.


The author uses G25 and qpAdm models to illustrate these points, using Cypriots as an example due to their relative ease of modeling.


Please note that this is a forum post and the information may not be entirely accurate or comprehensive. The full thread might contain further points of discussion and counterarguments from other users. Due to time constraints, I was unable to fully explore the thread and provide a complete summary. This summary is based on the initial post and the most relevant points that were apparent from the beginning of the thread​1​.




does this make sense with history, pre-history, and genetic studies?


ChatGPT


The discussion in the forum post does align with certain historical and genetic understandings, but it's important to note that this is a complex area of study, with ongoing research and some debate.


Historically, there were extensive connections between Greece and Italy. In the 8th century BC, Greeks established colonies in southern Italy and Sicily in a period known as Magna Graecia. These Greek settlers had significant cultural and genetic influence on the regions they settled. The post's suggestion that much of the Eastern Imperial admixture in Italians came directly from Greeks is generally in line with these historical events.


The post's claim that Imperial Greek genetic influence in Italy was predominantly from West Anatolians also could make sense historically. Anatolia (modern-day Turkey) was home to many Greek-speaking communities in antiquity, particularly in its western regions. Many of these Greeks could have been part of the populations that migrated to Italy during the period of Magna Graecia.


However, it's important to note that genetic research on ancient populations is a rapidly evolving field, and interpretations can vary based on the models and assumptions used. Genetic influence can come from many sources over many generations, and it's often difficult to draw definitive conclusions about the origins and migrations of ancient populations. The assertions made in the forum post, while potentially valid interpretations of the data, are part of a larger conversation among genetic researchers.


Additionally, the post's dismissal of the existence of an Imperial Greek profile in Sicily from the Bronze-Iron age is a more contentious point. There is ongoing research and debate about the genetic makeup of ancient Sicilian populations and the influence of different cultures, including the Greeks, Phoenicians, and native Sicilian tribes. Some genetic studies have suggested a complex mix of influences that evolved over time.


In conclusion, while the post's discussion aligns with some historical and genetic research, it's part of a larger, complex conversation about the genetic history of Italy and Greece. The findings and interpretations in the field of genetic research can vary, and they continue to be refined as new methods and data become available.
 
read and summarize this link: https://www.eupedia.com/forum/threa...n-Greeks-and-Italians-a-comparison-with-qpAdm

ChatGPT:

In the forum thread you provided, the original poster, who identifies as a Greek Cypriot, discusses genetic models and the shifts they indicate in Greek and Italian populations over time. The key points from the discussion are:


The models discussed do not imply direct ancestry but instead show the shifts in genetic patterns over time. This is illustrated by comparing G25 genetic models and a tool called qpAdm, which are used to predict genetic ancestry.


The author argues that most of the Eastern Imperial admixture in Italians seems to have come directly from Greeks, particularly Greek West Anatolians. They contest the idea that these people came from various parts of the Empire, arguing instead that they were mostly Greek West Anatolians and islanders.


The author discusses shifts in Rome over time compared to modern Italians, suggesting that the Imperial Greek profile was diluted by North Italians, forming the modern Central Italian profile.


The author disputes claims that the Imperial Greek profile existed in Sicily from the Bronze-Iron age and that it came from Anatolian Greeks or Bronze Age Anatolians, arguing that these claims are false.


The author uses G25 and qpAdm models to illustrate these points, using Cypriots as an example due to their relative ease of modeling.


Please note that this is a forum post and the information may not be entirely accurate or comprehensive. The full thread might contain further points of discussion and counterarguments from other users. Due to time constraints, I was unable to fully explore the thread and provide a complete summary. This summary is based on the initial post and the most relevant points that were apparent from the beginning of the thread​1​.




does this make sense with history, pre-history, and genetic studies?


ChatGPT


The discussion in the forum post does align with certain historical and genetic understandings, but it's important to note that this is a complex area of study, with ongoing research and some debate.


Historically, there were extensive connections between Greece and Italy. In the 8th century BC, Greeks established colonies in southern Italy and Sicily in a period known as Magna Graecia. These Greek settlers had significant cultural and genetic influence on the regions they settled. The post's suggestion that much of the Eastern Imperial admixture in Italians came directly from Greeks is generally in line with these historical events.


The post's claim that Imperial Greek genetic influence in Italy was predominantly from West Anatolians also could make sense historically. Anatolia (modern-day Turkey) was home to many Greek-speaking communities in antiquity, particularly in its western regions. Many of these Greeks could have been part of the populations that migrated to Italy during the period of Magna Graecia.


However, it's important to note that genetic research on ancient populations is a rapidly evolving field, and interpretations can vary based on the models and assumptions used. Genetic influence can come from many sources over many generations, and it's often difficult to draw definitive conclusions about the origins and migrations of ancient populations. The assertions made in the forum post, while potentially valid interpretations of the data, are part of a larger conversation among genetic researchers.


Additionally, the post's dismissal of the existence of an Imperial Greek profile in Sicily from the Bronze-Iron age is a more contentious point. There is ongoing research and debate about the genetic makeup of ancient Sicilian populations and the influence of different cultures, including the Greeks, Phoenicians, and native Sicilian tribes. Some genetic studies have suggested a complex mix of influences that evolved over time.


In conclusion, while the post's discussion aligns with some historical and genetic research, it's part of a larger, complex conversation about the genetic history of Italy and Greece. The findings and interpretations in the field of genetic research can vary, and they continue to be refined as new methods and data become available.

This so scary. Humans are doomed.
 
Silly robot:
[FONT=Söhne]If f(x) is continuous and always rational in the segment then f(x) is constant?[/FONT]

No, it is not necessarily true that if a function f(x) is continuous and always rational on a segment, then f(x) is constant.
The fact that f(x) is continuous and always rational only guarantees that the function takes on rational values throughout the segment, but it does not imply that the function cannot vary or change its values within the rational numbers. There can be rational functions that are not constant.
To illustrate this, consider the function f(x) = x on the segment [0, 1]. This function is continuous and always rational (since every value of x in the segment [0, 1] is rational), but it is not constant. It varies linearly with x, taking on different rational values for different x values within the segment.
Therefore, the continuity and rationality of a function on a segment do not imply its constancy.


Completely wrong.
 
Silly robot:
[FONT=Söhne]If f(x) is continuous and always rational in the segment then f(x) is constant?[/FONT]

No, it is not necessarily true that if a function f(x) is continuous and always rational on a segment, then f(x) is constant.
The fact that f(x) is continuous and always rational only guarantees that the function takes on rational values throughout the segment, but it does not imply that the function cannot vary or change its values within the rational numbers. There can be rational functions that are not constant.
To illustrate this, consider the function f(x) = x on the segment [0, 1]. This function is continuous and always rational (since every value of x in the segment [0, 1] is rational), but it is not constant. It varies linearly with x, taking on different rational values for different x values within the segment.
Therefore, the continuity and rationality of a function on a segment do not imply its constancy.


Completely wrong.

Tried the same question several times and got answered no with a different inaccurate explanation.
If may work for genetics, biology or chemistry but definitely not for mathematics:


To determine the convergence of the series ∑ (sin(n))^3/n, we can again use the comparison test.Since -1 ≤ sin(n) ≤ 1 for all n, we can bound the series term (sin(n))^3/n as follows:
-1/n ≤ (sin(n))^3/n ≤ 1/n
Now, let's compare the series ∑ (sin(n))^3/n with the series ∑ 1/n.
Considering the series ∑ 1/n, it is a known fact that the harmonic series diverges.
By comparison, if we have a series ∑ a(n) and ∑ b(n) such that 0 ≤ a(n) ≤ b(n) for all n, and if ∑ b(n) diverges, then ∑ a(n) also diverges.
In our case, since -1/n ≤ (sin(n))^3/n ≤ 1/n and ∑ 1/n diverges, we can conclude that ∑ (sin(n))^3/n also diverges.
Therefore, the series ∑ (sin(n))^3/n does not converge; it diverges.

This series does, in fact, converge. Some answers were accurate with a second approach but with a weak explanation.
 
ChatGPT:
The majority of slaves in ancient Rome did not come from the western regions. Slavery in Rome involved individuals from various parts of the Roman Empire and beyond, but it is generally believed that the majority of slaves came from the eastern Mediterranean and other regions outside of the western territories.
The eastern regions of the Roman Empire, including Greece, Asia Minor (modern-day Turkey), Egypt, and the Levant, were significant sources of slaves for Rome. These regions had established slave markets and were known for their supply of slaves. Greek slaves, in particular, were highly valued for their education, skills, and cultural contributions.
 
ChatGPT:
The majority of slaves in ancient Rome did not come from the western regions. Slavery in Rome involved individuals from various parts of the Roman Empire and beyond, but it is generally believed that the majority of slaves came from the eastern Mediterranean and other regions outside of the western territories.
The eastern regions of the Roman Empire, including Greece, Asia Minor (modern-day Turkey), Egypt, and the Levant, were significant sources of slaves for Rome. These regions had established slave markets and were known for their supply of slaves. Greek slaves, in particular, were highly valued for their education, skills, and cultural contributions.
apart from italian slaves, ie, Samnites etc that Rome had..............the first where the Macedonian/Greek slaves after the battle of Pydna 168BC
then quarter of a million Carthagians on 146BC ( 3rd roman-carthagian war ).
then half a million Gauls from Caesar conquests of Gaul.
then 250, 000 Illyrians ( Dalmatians and Pannonians ) in the great illyrian revolt in early AD times.
by the time the Romans took Mid East slaves, the Romans took Thracian slaves in between.
to say Romans had a lot of Levant slaves is a stretch..................more accurately , one would say the Levant slaves where one of the last Groups to be enslaved by the romans.
 

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