I2a-Din came to the Balkans and Dinaric Alps with the Thracians, Dacians & Illyrians

[LeBrok]

My first language Polish I know what means Wloch, it refers to modern Italians but is loosely thrown term that also refers to Wlosi root word of HAIR in my language, which we use to refer any dark haired people as slang. When I discussed with my father regarding his grandfather my greatgrandfather who lived in Bukovina and identified as Bulgarian, my father referred to him being Wloch which means "dark and hairy".

Maybe this is how you understood your father. Your expalanation is at least a bit confusing. Is you father saying that your grandfather is Wloch, because of him being dark and hairy or was he from real Vlach community? I never heard any polish person referring to a brunet, even a hairy one, as wloch in my life. And I'm polish.
Maybe he was saining, Wlochaty and not Wloch?

Also White Croats defended southern border of Poland for centuries and never moved from this place despite bloodshed.

Can you refer us to polish historical source.

 

[Fatherland]

This Russian scientist, have a name?

He never found anything that Garrick attempts to project about. Don't let him confuse you or other folks.

 

[LeBrok]

Another question, if these White Croats my grandfather who was born Bukovina, Romania never identify Polish why would they fight for Poland during WW2 and consequentially take refuge in Southern Poland when the new borders were drawn 1945? Polish person is mixed-slavic person, check my oracle the answers are infront of you. If White-Croats wasnt Polish as you are claiming maybe in profile I would have flag Croatia, or Romania maybe Bulgaria, but that clearly not the scenario here I was born POLE.

Maybe you didn't understand the point, because I said Polish people in A-H empire. I should have said, all people (or almost all) who lived on former Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth land, under Austro-Hungarian jurisdiction were called White Chroats by Austro-Hungarian government.

 

[Kingslav]

I have uncle non blood relation but intermarriage, he is smaller stature guy maybe 5’6 dark moustache and dark tan, everyone in family refers to him WLOCH as friendly joke meaning Italian, nonetheless he is Polish. Wloch is oftenly thrown around term in my family and other southern Poles I know. Personally I cant speak for R1B I dont really know any. Maybe you make Baltic jokes Im not sure.

 

[Leka]

This Russian scientist, have a name?

Not at the moment, he is however Garric's bed buddy from the looks of it that 'leaks' on his ear, here and there, secrets of his futuristic projects. I say he is solid, we should trust him.

 

[LABERIA]

He never found anything that Garrick attempts to project about. Don't let him confuse you or other folks.

My question was a contribution exactly in this direction. He(Garrick) pretend that he have this exchange of emails with this Russian scientist. First of all it's important to know who is this scientist. I am not saying that this person exist or not, but we want to know who is him, his academic background, etc. A name.

 

[Kingslav]

Most of those Ukrainians looks like they could be Vladimir Putin's brother, they definitely fit the Eastern European sterotype. The president of Poland looks so similar he could be Vladimir Putin's brother as well. In Wisconsin, I vacation there in the summer, there's lots of Polish immigrants and lots of them also have this typical Slavic look. Even though they have the same pigmentation as British-German-Swedish Americans it is easy to recognize who is a Polish immigrant. I see it in a lot of Yugoslavs in my neighborhood as well.

That interests me because it indicates EEF-WHG-Steppe stuff can't explain everything, there could Slavic-specific traits that people in Ireland with a similar EEF-WHG-Steppe makeup don't share.

We dont have pigmentation of British-German-Swedish lol maybe odd Baltic mixed Ukrainian or eastern Ukrainian does, it is summer now and sorry my skin is not white nor red. Probably shouldnt admit but all my life I get mistaken for Albanian 1st choice by some people to be honest. Now, lets pretend I didnt mention that dilemma. Moving on...

 

[LABERIA]

Not at the moment, he is however Garric's bed buddy from the looks of it that 'leaks' on his ear, here and there, secrets of his futurustic projects. I say he is solid, we should trust him.

Ku je o Drenicë. Long time that i don't see you my friend.

 

[Milan.M]

During the 18th, 19th and part of 20th centuries when Russia, Austro-Hungary, Prussia divided Polish Commonwealth among their "ambitious" selves, they tried refer to my ancestors living south of Carpathian Mountains (Podkarpackie) as RUSYNS or RUTHENIANS. Here is some info on Rusyns.

" Their language, called Rusyn or Ruthenian, is a variety of East Slavic and is spoken in Lemko, Hutsul, Boyko/Bojkian, Sjan, and Transcarpathian/Verchovyna dialects.

Their traditional religions for centuries have been Eastern Orthodoxy and Greek Catholicism.

It's believed that the Rusyns descend from multiple old tribes including White Croats, Rus', and Vlachs.

It is interesting to add that according to some American documents from the beginning of 20th century there were about 100,000 immigrants to the US born around Kraków (Southern Poland) who declared themselves to be Bielo-Chorvats, i.e. White Croats by nationality."

Among Rusyn members of the "Carpatho-Rusyn Heritage DNA Project", these are among the Y-DNA haplogroups:

• E-L117 from some with ancestors from Slovakia and Ukraine,
• E-L142 from some with ancestors from Ukraine and Poland,
• E-L542 from some with ancestors from Ukraine, Poland, and Slovakia,
• I-M170 from some with ancestors from Ukraine and Slovakia,
• I-P37 from some with ancestors from Ukraine, Poland, and Slovakia,
• R-M198 from some with ancestors from Slovakia,
• R-M269 from some with ancestors from Slovakia and Poland,
• R-M512 from some with ancestors from Slovakia, Czechia, Poland, and Ukraine,
• R-Z283 from some with ancestors from Slovakia and Ukraine,
• R-SRY10831 from some with ancestors from Ukraine and Poland,
• and I-CTS10228, R-Z280, and several more.

- Rusyn Genetics, Khazaria.com

My ancestors descended from Vlachs which is opposing Tomenable earlier statement that Poles do not descend from Vlachs. Also no R1B was found among these southern POLISH/ UKRAINIANS. Even some haplogroup E was found but definitely no R1B here.

I didn't knew you are from that region Kingslav,very interesting.I know some other people with similar ancestry like yours,maybe coincidence or not,they are all emotionaly somehow "attached" to South Slavs.Thank you.
I was discussing the genetics of the Hutsuls,Boykos and Lemkos couple of times in this forum but i did not had much information about it but from other people sayings i knew they are "south-slavic" shifted or similar.

That's the old Getae land,so your statements were right all along,from that region and Danube basin our ancestors used to fight the Roman empire until their defeat.
To Galicia,Dniester or Tyras were living Tyragetae sub tribe of the Getae.Old name of the Sclavenes (Slavs) acording to ancient authors.

You are Kingslav,Tomenable Kingwend hehe


The first ruler of the Piasts Mieszko was "Dagome, King of the Wends"
Real Kingwends were majority R1a or R1b?

 

[Kingslav]

I didn't knew you are from that region Kingslav,very interesting.I know some other people with similar ancestry like yours,maybe coincidence or not,they are all emotionaly somehow "attached" to South Slavs.Thank you.
I was discussing the genetics of the Hutsuls,Boykos and Lemkos couple of times in this forum but i did not had much information about it but from other people sayings i knew they are "south-slavic" shifted or similar.

That's the old Getae land,so your statements were right all along,from that region and Danube basin our ancestors used to fight the Roman empire until their defeat.
To Galicia,Dniester or Tyras were living Tyragetae sub tribe of the Getae. Old name of the Sclavenes (Slavs) acording to ancient authors.

You are Kingslav,Tomenable Kingwend hehe


The first ruler of the Piasts Mieszko was "Dagome, King of the Wends"
Real Kingwends were majority R1a or R1b?

Thank you for seeing truth brother, much appreciated. My family is South-Slavic shifted on both sides Paternal, Maternal. This is complicated history I know, in this region of world with wars, and borders re-drawing. Ukraina in my language literally means "borderland". There is more similarity than differences between us Eastern Europeans and Albanians included also. There will always be nationalism, religion, history, etc to seperate us but is what it is. We must stay strong against all the western spys. Yes the Polish dynasty was R1B to my surprise but also was Romanov dynasty in Russia R1B also. I dont believe much importance as they make it seem, probably family with most acquired wealth and ruling power in that era were R1B I dont see any other importance of R1B being a major haplogroup among slavs.

 

[Kingslav]

I didn't knew you are from that region Kingslav,very interesting.I know some other people with similar ancestry like yours,maybe coincidence or not,they are all emotionaly somehow "attached" to South Slavs.Thank you.
I was discussing the genetics of the Hutsuls,Boykos and Lemkos couple of times in this forum but i did not had much information about it but from other people sayings i knew they are "south-slavic" shifted or similar.

That's the old Getae land,so your statements were right all along,from that region and Danube basin our ancestors used to fight the Roman empire until their defeat.
To Galicia,Dniester or Tyras were living Tyragetae sub tribe of the Getae.

I am closer shifted with South Slavs, than West Slavs or East Slavs. This what I know about grandparents.

Paternal Grandfather- Bulgarian
Paternal Grandmother- Polish
Maternal Grandmother- Ukrainian/ Latvian
Maternal Grandfather- Sephardic Spanish/ Serbian

Unfortunately I only knew 2 of 4 grandparents other 2 passed away prior my birth, my babcia (grandma) raised me from birth until 6 years I am very grateful for this.

 

[Milan.M]

Piast could even be a merchant,he also could be native with R1b there is still Slavs carrying that haplogroup.Romanov was also not Rus neither Rurikid.They were brought there after dinastic crisis.
I don't know much about Piasts so excuse me if i made some mistake is still Polish history,but taken in consideration the steps they made in religion and state building,also the steps against pagans and Polabian Slavs together with Germans/Franks,he was with ties with Holy Roman empire,that is visible.

 

[Kingslav]

Piast could even be a merchant with an army,Romanov was also not Rus neither Rurikid.They were brought there after dinastic crisis.
I don't know much about Piasts so excuse me if i made some mistake is still Polish history,but taken in consideration the steps they made in religion and state building in those time they were going hand in hand anyway,also the steps against pagans and Polabian Slavs together with Germans/Franks,he was with ties with Holy Roman empire,that is visible.

I agree, R1B had to come from west it wasnt originated from Poland.

 

[Milan.M]

Kingslav please don't use the word "western spys" here,they might not understand the sarcasm and ban you.I know there is a page "Squating Slavs" on facebook where they use this in sarcastic way but still they might get you wrong here.

 

[Tomenable]

I1-M253 all over Iron Age Poland:

http://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...lish-DNA/page3?p=513761&viewfull=1#post513761

Three of them belonged to the sub-branch I1a3a1a1a (I-L1237)

Subclade I-L1237 on YFull: https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-L1237/

The basal lineage of this subclade, I-L1237*, can be found here:

So Jordanes was right - the Goths had originated from Sweden?

I agree, R1B had to come from west it wasnt originated from Poland.

R1b actually originated from Russia, Yamnaya culture.

I2a has more western (WHG) origins than R1b (EHG).

 

[Garrick]

In regards to I2a-slav .........it is a very poor name, better to use dinaric for the mountains or something like a culture Vucedol
There are I2 in north italy Remendello culture

These days one Asian man asked me that in three sentences fast say anything about what is characteric European. It is not easy (brain must do fast).

Answer:

1) I1 and I2 old European, haplogroup I is in Europe 35000 years
2) Greek democracy foundation for contemporary European democracy
3) Industrial revolution, foundation for development European economy and society

He asked me to add two actual things.

Answer:

1) Made in German, the best in the world
2) Beautiful European cities, nowhere in the world

He was very pleased, especially he was interested to know more about European haplogroups I1 and I2, about Greek democracy, and which European cities are must to see.

 

[Fire Haired14]

There will always be nationalism, religion, history, etc to seperate us but is what it is. We must stay strong against all the western spys.

Eastern Europe didn't have nationalism between 1945 and 1991. And did you notice the Polish crowd chanted "USA, USA!" at the end of Trump's uplifting anti-Soviet, anti-Russia, pro-Poland speech yesterday.

 

[Kingslav]

What means didnt have nationalism? We always had nationalism. 1945, 1991, 966 or any others you can imagine. We have complex government that is different from western democracy for long time. I fail to see how that is not nationalism? - FireHaired14

 

[Kingslav]

I1-M253 all over Iron Age Poland:

http://www.eupedia.com/forum/thread...lish-DNA/page3?p=513761&viewfull=1#post513761

Subclade I-L1237 on YFull: https://www.yfull.com/tree/I-L1237/

The basal lineage of this subclade, I-L1237*, can be found here:

So Jordanes was right - the Goths had originated from Sweden?

R1b actually originated from Russia, Yamnaya culture.

I2a has more western (WHG) origins than R1b (EHG).

Nice effort Tomenable you almost sneaked 1 again. As we know I is the original European haplogroup only 1 that survived last glacial maximum, we could expect I haplogroup native European haplogroup people to mix with ancient WHG since they were in Europe also. No surprise. You saying that your haplogroup R1B originated in Russia Yamnaya and didn't mix with WHG is your claim. Ok. Also you said I2A has more WHG than R1B, I did compare and actually you have more WHG than my I2A sample.

2) Tomenable, Polish (haplogroup: R1b-DF27):


Admix Results (sorted):


# Population Percent
1 West_European_Hunter_Gartherer 43.79
2 Natufian 34.21
3 Ancestral_North_Eurasian 20.69
4 Ancestral_South_Eurasian 1
5 East_Asian 0.31


Ancient Eurasia K6
Compared Results.

Kingslav WHG- 42.82 - I2A
Tomenable WHG- 43.79 - R1B

Can you explain?

 

[LeBrok]

What means didnt have nationalism? We always had nationalism. 1945, 1991, 966 or any others you can imagine. We have complex government that is different from western democracy for long time. I fail to see how that is not nationalism? - FireHaired14

Not during P-L Commonwealth. Everybody was preoccupied how to keep a country of many religions and ethnicities together.