(offtopic about Albanian)

[Zeus10]

Greeks call their country Hellas, foreigners call it Greece.Latin name of the nation was Graeci, from which the English name Greeks originates. These names in turn trace their origin from Graecus, the Latin adaptation of the Greek name Γραικός, which means 'Greek' but its etymology remains uncertain. It is unclear why the Romans called the country Graecia and its people Graeci, while the Greeks called their land Hellas and themselves Hellenes, and several speculations have been made.

One of the speculations I have read from Yetos regarding etymology of the name graecia is that it means "old women" and could cognate with or come from Albanian "grua", woman.

Can I make a request that Greece asks other countries to stop calling it Greece as this name's origin is either unknown or stems from Albanian name for women?

This is correct Kesi.
The name Graecus, has been associated to the Albanian word for women: 'gra'(singular:grua) and the same meaning word in the Ancient Greek:

γραες-graes
γραια-gra-ia

now on obsolete in the Modern Greek language.

To confirm this it's been personally Homerus(Iliad 2.681), who calls the tiny Hellas in Thessaly:

νῦν αὖ τοὺς ὅσσοι τὸ Πελασγικὸν Ἄργος ἔναιον,
οἵ τ᾽ Ἄλον οἵ τ᾽ Ἀλόπην οἵ τε Τρηχῖνα νέμοντο,
οἵ τ᾽ εἶχον Φθίην ἠδ᾽ Ἑλλάδα καλλιγύναικα,
Μυρμιδόνες δὲ καλεῦντο καὶ Ἕλληνες καὶ Ἀχαιοί,

Now all those again that inhabited Pelasgian Argos, and dwelt in Alos and Alope and Trachis, and that held Phthia and Hellas, the land of fair women, and were called Myrmidons and Hellenes and Achaeans—

To reinforce the idea even the "Greek" version of the name Ἑλλάδα reminds us the word LADY which goes back in time long before the modern phrase. The following is a table created from the prestigious Greek philologist Thomopulos.

 

[Yetos]

Aha, is it the same as the greek term Graikos? ? Or is it a "wider" term of the wider greek world?

not Exactly.
Γραικος is after Γραιος Γηραιος elder ones.
Before Dorians we see more tribal names, like Mycenae Minoans Minyans Myrmidones etc.
After Dorians we see a unification movement that creates the word Ελληνας.
But In homer we find the 'Greek' as term for Epirotans and upper-Thessalians upper- Makedonians (land of Dorians and Aeolins) as non Mykeneans non Minoans etc.
a city build by Γραιοι named Κυμη created a colony in Italy cyme, after which the term Greek become exonyms of Greeks,

 

[Yetos]

This is correct Kesi.
The name Graecus, has been associated to the Albanian word for women: 'gra'(singular:grua) and the same meaning word in the Ancient Greek:

γραες-graes
γραια-gra-ia

now on obsolete in the Modern Greek language.

To confirm this it's been personally Homerus(Iliad 2.681), who calls the tiny Hellas in Thessaly:

νῦν αὖ τοὺς ὅσσοι τὸ Πελασγικὸν Ἄργος ἔναιον,
οἵ τ᾽ Ἄλον οἵ τ᾽ Ἀλόπην οἵ τε Τρηχῖνα νέμοντο,
οἵ τ᾽ εἶχον Φθίην ἠδ᾽ Ἑλλάδα καλλιγύναικα,
Μυρμιδόνες δὲ καλεῦντο καὶ Ἕλληνες καὶ Ἀχαιοί,



To reinforce the idea even the "Greek" version of the name Ἑλλάδα reminds us the word LADY which goes back in time long before the modern phrase. The following is a table created from the prestigious Greek philologist Thomopulos.

Thank you Zeus 10

You Just found That Albanian Gra is a Loan word from Greek Γηραιος Γηρας Γέρος Γραια

cause In Greek
Γηρας = to become old, elderly
Γηραιος Γερος = Old MAN
Γηραια Γραια Γρια = OLD WOMAN

IT IS OBVIOUS THAT ALBANIAN NOT ONLY BORROWED WORDS FROM GREEKS, BUT THEY USE IT WRONG ALSO

THANK YOU ZEUS,
YOU MADE MY DAY AGAIN


SO GREEK OLD MAN IS AFTER ALBANIAN WOMAN? AND THE COUNCIL OF ELEDERS IS AFTER ALBANIAN WORD WOMAN?
nice joke Zeus, I wonder about the laugh of the other mambers





PS

KESI DON"T CHANGE NAMES. AND FLAGS, ZEUS BETRAYED YOU

You are not even able to change IDs

VERY FUNNY,

GODS I HAVE an ache in my stomach with so much laugh

ZEUS so the word for elederly in Greek (Γηρας) is after ALBANIAN word for women right?

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

NICE JOKE,

So IT is true when Gustan Mayer said 10% words in Albanian iare loans from Greek

 

[Zeus10]

I know albanians have some fantasy about them being pelasgian/illyrian

This "fantasy" has nothing to do to Albanians, this is a product ofan entire generation of prestigious European philologists. I don't know if theconnection to Illyrians is correct but for now we will 'stick' to the nameEpirote:

and having birthrights to the whole Balkan peninsula but the truth isthat Albanians per se hasn't played a significant role in the Balkans atall.

Albanians have played the crucial part of the 'game' in the Balkans, beforeRussia creating the puppet states like Serbia and Greece and their artificialnations.

 

[Hal Fao]

Albanians have played the crucial part of the 'game' in the Balkans, beforeRussia creating the puppet states like Serbia and Greece and their artificialnations.

Please, stop the nationalistic propaganda. This is a linguistic forum.

 

[Zemra]

At the end of dienekes is a link to the official document if you do not like what they say........go check the official documents.

It's says two minor populations from Albania", not Albanians. Minor populations include from Albania Greeks, Gypsies, Vlach etc. Please find "minor dialects".

No, it was an example to show you the system that is used at the time.

It was never used by Albanians, everything else doesn't matter.

All that is written about the latin word Albanoi is that it means foreigner , that is ...not from these lands.

The first time ever this has come out. I'm pretty sure real researches before you had already thought about it, but dismissed it. It's the Roman Empire, everyone they conquered was a foreigner. There's really no logic in that claim.

someone now refers to albanians as epirotes from Italian texts.....make up your mind , what do Albanians want to claim ?

The language was referred apparently as epirotecum. The people as Arbëresh. Little details meaning nothing, perhaps it was just for geographical convenience. Why do you think it's a claim for anything?

insulting to call an Albanian Shqiptar , really...no wonder you have problems...its your language isn't it. its noted everywhere.
Is this a tosk .v. gheg thing?

It didn't have to be, but it has been used that way. The same thing as the N-word. It was never meant to be insulting, just defining of a specific group of people. Now it's not used anymore by anyone but they themselves.

many countries have changed there name from western to their true peoples name, Siam, Burma to name just 2

And they can be easily pronounced in English. "Q" is a voiceless palatal affricate, good luck on trying to pronounce it. Albania is better that any name you can use to butcher it. Beside it's not hurting anyone. Get over it.

I care little for your medieval, renaissance, industrial, modern times .........i am after the ancient part.

The why did you kept bullying to me? I never talked about it.

 

[Zemra]

Looking more into the word ALBANOI , I came across some articles that albanians are related to Chechens as per linguistic similarities below............I only copied a few ( or else it would be pages on pages )

The ETYMOLOGY OF ALL THE WORDS YOU COPY-PASTED

CHECHENIA=ICHQERIA
ALBANIA=SHQIPËRIA, is it so hard to spell? shqiptoj<Latin expicere
Chechen=aakharkho,Albanian=katundar,English=peasan t <katund "village"< PIE
Chechen=alsamoo,Albanian=më shumë,English=more <Latin summus
Chechen=aagan,Albanian=egër,English=wild <Greek agrios
Chechen=aara dalan,Albanian=dal jashtë,English=get out <PIE, Compound expression, both words have cognates in Greek thallo and A.Greek ektos
Chechen=aaradaqqa,Albanian=terhheq,English=withdraw<PIE, Cognates Lithuanian vulku and Greek Aulaki
Chencen aaradovila; Albanian=rrugedalje,English=e xit Compound of Latin loan "ruga" and "dal", etymology explained above
Chechen=aare,Albanian=rrafsh,English=plain <PIE, English< Latin planus< Greek plano
Chechen=arzha,Albanian=zeze,English=black <PIE feminine of zi, compare Dutch kwaad
Chechen=aaz,Albanian=ze,English=voice PIE, compare Serbo-Croatian zvon
Chechen=baarz,Albanian=varr,English=grave <PIE, cognates Gothic
Chechen=banka,Albanian=burre,English=man <PIE, cognates German bauer
Chechen=baar,Albanian=arre,English=nut <PIE, cogantes A.Greek arua, SerboCroatian orah, Lativian rieksts
Chechen=bashkhan,Albanian=shkelqyer,English=excell ent < Latin, obvious in bothEnglish and Albanian
Chechen=bekhka,Albanian=borxh,English=debt,obligat ion <Turkish borç
Chechen=bil ma,Albanian=fal me,English=im sorry wrong meaning, explaining Albanain pronouns will need a whole other section, anyway "fal" and "call" are related
Chechen=besan,Albanian=zbehte,English=pale <PIE, Lithuanian izblyskes
Chechen=buha,Albanian=buf,English=owl <Latin bufus
Chechen=cham,Albanian=shijshem,English=tasty <shije<PIE, see Lithuanian skonis
Chechen=yaalla,waala,Albanian=eja,English=come here see also Greek ela
Chechen=chu,Albanian=hyj,English=get in <PIE, see also: A.Greek au, Baltic au, Celtic hou etc
Chechen=daago,Albanian=djeg,English=burn <PIE, comapre English day, Lithuanian degti, greek tefra
Chechen=dahiita,Albanian=dergoj,English=send <Latin dirigo
Chechen=dehndi,Albanian=gjedhe,English=cattle <PIE, apparently English sit is the right cognate
Chechen=dain,Albanian=drite,English=light <PIE, O.English torht
Chechen=daakhkan,Albanian=gjendem,English=located <gjej "to find", compare English get, Greek kteme
Chechen=delqa,Albanian=dreke,English=lunch <PIE, cognates A.Greek dropon found also in a some certain Paleo-Balkan languages
Chechen=dowgha,Albanian=djeges,English=hot <"djeg", see above for etymology
Chechen=duq,Albanian=aq,English=so many <PIE, cogantes Latin quae
Chechen=dyelkha,Albanian=kerkoj?,English=to cry actual meaning "to search", <Latin circo/ "qaj" means "to cry" <PIE, see German klagen
Chechen=eskar,Albanian=ushtri,English=army <Latin hostis
Chechen=ghaighanii,Albanian=hidheroj,English=make sad < "hidhur"<PIE, see also A.Greek aithein, Lithuanian aitrus
Chechen=ghaala,Albanian=kala,English=castle actual meaning "sand castle" <Turkish, kështjellë <Latin castellum
Chechen=gaalat,Albanian=gabim,English=mistake they start with the same letter, that's about it
Chechen=ghishto,Albanian=ngrehine,English=building <ngre <PIE, cognates Latin cresco
Chechen=gharlima,Albanian=ngrirje,English=freezing <PIE, also "mërdhij"<mardhë<PIE, see also Polish mroz
Chechen=goola,Albanian=gju,English=knee <PIE, see also O.Irish glun
Chechen=hakkha,Albanian=terheq,English=draw DUPLICATES, see above
Chechen=hoqa,Albanian=kete,English=this <PIE, The relation with English it's actually pretty obvious
Chechen=hostam,Albanian=gozhde,English=nail <Slavic, see Polish gwozdz
Chechen=khalkhar,Albanian=kercej,English=dance at least get the dentition right
Chechen=khan,Albanian=kohe,English=time <PIE, Old Prussian kissman
Chechen=khasbesh,Albanian=kopesht,English=garden <PIE, cognates Greek kipos
Chechen=keeda,Albanian=qetem,English=cut How did pres became an alien word
Chechen=khena,Albanian=kohe,English=weather kohë explained above, "mot"<PIE, see als Latin tempus, A.Greek metis
Chechen=khila,Albanian=qene,English=been Albanian verbs, one of them has 130 possible conjugations compared to English 25. You found 1/130. Find the rest of 129
Chechen=khilam,Albanian=kam,English=have <PIE, see A.Greek pepamai
Chechen=kho,Albanian=vezë,English=egg Get the definiton right firist. Anyway<PIE, cognates Latin ovum
Chechen=kog,Albanian=kembe,English=leg,foot <Latin gamba
Chechen=Iighana,Albanian=Inatosur,English=Angry zemëruar"<"zemra" heart<PIE, "inatosur"<"inat"<SERBO-CROATIAN<Turkish
Chechen=nana,Albanian=nene,English=mother mëmë, amë, get the defition right, nënë it's related to nonna and has the same meaning
Chechen=Ysh,Albanian=Ishin,english=they were Albanian verbs
Chechen=shu,Albanian=ju,English=you English and Albanian are PRONOUNCED THE SAME

Looking into the genetics of the Chechans, they have less than 1% E ........BUT, there is always the J2 which is chechan. BUT what about the E in albania, not popular further north in Bosnia, croatia, slovenia etc
could the north-east migration into Albania as noted by the links I previously attached mean, the linguistic part.

as per notes:
The I2a-deficiency of the Arbereshe also gives support to the theory that the Albanians are relatively recent arrivals from the northeast; this theory has been upheld in the past on the basis of the (i) their historical obscurity until the last millennium, and (ii) the paucity of native sea terms and Greek loanwords in Albanian, which is difficult to explain if Albanians always occupied their current location on the Adriatic.

Here we go again. You know, the border between Proto-Romanians an Proto-Albanians was Morava valley in Serbia. Not to mention you're looking way too far from the Roman Empire borders.

Arbëresh study can be thrown in a garbage because it too flawed.

As for the Chechen I don't know where you see the similarities of those words. Not to mention they're all PIE, with a few loans. Not to forget the ones who's meaning is completely off.

Since this forum doesn't allow me to copy-paste, just search for the etymology of the cognates/comparison words.

 

[kesi]

SO GREEK OLD MAN IS AFTER ALBANIAN WOMAN? AND THE COUNCIL OF ELEDERS IS AFTER ALBANIAN WORD WOMAN?
nice joke Zeus, I wonder about the laugh of the other mambers

or vice versa, in Albanian name Greece means 'gra land" literally "women land" cool !

PS

KESI DON"T CHANGE NAMES. AND FLAGS, ZEUS BETRAYED YOU

You are not even able to change IDs

LOL this is indeed funny..before assuming I am Zeus why don't you ask the administrator if we are the same or not, I am sure he can tell you the truth

VERY FUNNY,

GODS I HAVE an ache in my stomach with so much laugh

ZEUS so the word for elederly in Greek (Γηρας) is after ALBANIAN word for women right?

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

not so funny considering that "gra" is an obsolete word in Greek but continues in use by Albanians. And why Albanians copied it from Greeks? Do you have any proof?

I just checked, elderly=ηλικιωμένος , google translate

 

[kamani]

or vice versa, in Albanian name Greece means 'gra land" literally "women land" cool !

if you really want to get down to it "greqi" means something else, but let's not go there.

 

[Bodric]

or vice versa, in Albanian name Greece means 'gra land" literally "women land" cool !



LOL this is indeed funny..before assuming I am Zeus why don't you ask the administrator if we are the same or not, I am sure he can tell you the truth



not so funny considering that "gra" is an obsolete word in Greek but continues in use by Albanians. And why Albanians copied it from Greeks? Do you have any proof?

I just checked, elderly=ηλικιωμένος , google translate

Tbh honest there are loanwords that are more persistant in the borrowing nations vocabulary than in the nation they borrowed it from.

There are many words from the greek language that we serbs borrowed and haven't really changed whilst the greeks through the national unification processes have standradised the language.

You get what I'm saying? Let's say you borrow the word dad from the turks (which u did).

Bab - Dad - Bab (ottoman turkish if I'm not totally wrong)

Bab - Dad - Baba (modern turkish)

They standardized it while u didn't.

Shit happen. Albanians did borrow many words from serbs/greeks/latins/turks for a reason. These countries held dominion over modern Albania for a majority of times. Even though u loaned massive words you still have your own substratum and language. So the loanwords are just superficial u dreq

 

[Zeus10]

Looking more into the word ALBANOI, I came across some articles that albanians are related to Chechens as perlinguistic similarities below............I only copied a few ( or else it wouldbe pages on pages )


CHECHENIA=ICHQERIA
ALBANIA=SHQIPTERIA
Chechen=aakharkho,Albanian=katundar,English=peasan t
Chechen=alsamoo,Albanian=me shume,English=more
Chechen=aagan,Albanian=eker,English=wild(3)
Chechen=aara dalan,Albanian=jashte dal,English=get out
Chechen=aaradaqqa,Albanian=terhoqa,English=withdra w
Chechen=aaradovlilla,Albanian=rrugedalje,English=e xit
Chechen=aare,Albanian=rrafsh,English=plain
Chechen=arzha,Albanian=zeze,English=black
Chechen=aaz,Albanian=ze,English=voice
Chechen=baarz,Albanian=varr,English=grave
Chechen=banka,Albanian=burre,English=man
Chechen=baar,Albanian=arre,English=nut
Chechen=bashkhan,Albanian=shkelqyer,English=excell ent
Chechen=bekhka,Albanian=borxh,English=debt,obligat ion
Chechen=bil ma,Albanian=fal me,English=im sorry
Chechen=besan,Albanian=zbehte,English=pale
Chechen=buha,Albanian=buf,English=owl
Chechen=cham,Albanian=shijshem,English=tasty
Chechen=yaalla,waala,Albanian=eja,English=come here (1)
Chechen=chu,Albanian=hyj,English=get in
Chechen=daago,Albanian=djeg,English=burn
Chechen=dahiita,Albanian=dergoj,English=send
Chechen=dehndi,Albanian=gjedhe,English=cattle
Chechen=dain,Albanian=drite,English=light
Chechen=daakhkan,Albanian=gjendem,English=located
Chechen=delqa,Albanian=dreke,English=lunch
Chechen=dowgha,Albanian=djeges,English=hot
Chechen=duq,Albanian=aq,English=so many
Chechen=dyelkha,Albanian=kerkoj,English=to cry
Chechen=eskar,Albanian=ushtri,English=army
Chechen=ghaighanii,Albanian=hidheroj,English=make sad
Chechen=ghaala,Albanian=kala,English=castle
Chechen=gaalat,Albanian=gabim,English=mistake
Chechen=ghishto,Albanian=ngrehine,English=building
Chechen=gharlima,Albanian=ngrirje,English=freezing
Chechen=goola,Albanian=gju,English=knee
Chechen=hakkha,Albanian=terheq,English=draw
Chechen=hoqa,Albanian=kete,English=this
Chechen=hostam,Albanian=gozhde,English=nail
Chechen=khalkhar,Albanian=kercej,English=dance
Chechen=khan,Albanian=kohe,English=time
Chechen=khasbesh,Albanian=kopesht,English=garden
Chechen=keeda,Albanian=qetem,English=cut
Chechen=khena,Albanian=kohe,English=weather
Chechen=khila,Albanian=qene,English=been
Chechen=khilam,Albanian=kam,English=have
Chechen=kho,Albanian=koqeve,English=egg
Chechen=kog,Albanian=kembe,English=leg,foot
Chechen=Iighana,Albanian=Inatosur,English=Angry
Chechen=nana,Albanian=nene,English=mother
Chechen=Ysh,Albanian=Ishin,english=they were
Chechen=shu,Albanian=ju,English=you(2)

I was looking at the above list carrying so many exhausted (dis)similarities and I couldn't hold my laugh. It's unbelievable how far distant most of the words are beyond point of exhaustion and how many inaccuracies you encounter here. I won’t waste any time to give any credit at all to this 'bright' list, but I want to ask Zanipolo since he was the one impressed by this"similarities", what do you think about line (1):

Chechen=yaalla,waala,Albanian=eja,English=come here
I will add the Greek word in the list: έλα, isn't this closerto the Chechen word?

What about (3)?
Chechen=aagan,Albanian=eker,English=wild
and GREEK άγριος

and then (2)

Chechen=shu,Albanian=ju,English=you
GREEK σύ

Since ju(ALb) and you(ENG) are pronounced exactly the same,does it make English language close to the CheCHEN one?

 

[Yetos]

or vice versa, in Albanian name Greece means 'gra land" literally "women land" cool !



LOL this is indeed funny..before assuming I am Zeus why don't you ask the administrator if we are the same or not, I am sure he can tell you the truth



not so funny considering that "gra" is an obsolete word in Greek but continues in use by Albanians. And why Albanians copied it from Greeks? Do you have any proof?

I just checked, elderly=ηλικιωμένος , google translate

AGAIN YOU ARE DREAMINg

ALL old ladies ARE GRIES except grandma and all old men are Γεροι except grandpa due to honor, IN GREECE, AND THEIR HOUSE IS ΓΗΡΟΚΟΜΕΙΟ
so back to search more loan words from Greek to ALbanian,

 

[Yetos]

I was looking at the above list carrying so many exhausted (dis)similarities and I couldn't hold my laugh. It's unbelievable how far distant most of the words are beyond point of exhaustion and how many inaccuracies you encounter here. I won’t waste any time to give any credit at all to this 'bright' list, but I want to ask Zanipolo since he was the one impressed by this"similarities", what do you think about line (1):

Chechen=yaalla,waala,Albanian=eja,English=come here
I will add the Greek word in the list: έλα, isn't this closerto the Chechen word?

What about (3)?
Chechen=aagan,Albanian=eker,English=wild
and GREEK άγριος

and then (2)

Chechen=shu,Albanian=ju,English=you
GREEK σύ

Since ju(ALb) and you(ENG) are pronounced exactly the same,does it make English language close to the CheCHEN one?

all these and you found only 3 words?A

AAhahahaha,

so Only 3 words connect Greek with Chechen? how about that List you quote?
how may are there?

Besides Albanian is Clergy Language, the 3 older texts are Liturgy notes,
so was purified by Priests

 

[Zemra]

all these and you found only 3 words?

I found the etymology of all. Now will you all stop tr0lling?

 

[Zeus10]

all these and you found only 3 words?A

AAhahahaha,

so Only 3 words connect Greek with Chechen? how about that List you quote?
how may are there?

It deserves the trash bin.

 

[Yetos]

This "fantasy" has nothing to do to Albanians, this is a product ofan entire generation of prestigious European philologists. I don't know if theconnection to Illyrians is correct but for now we will 'stick' to the nameEpirote:

Albanians have played the crucial part of the 'game' in the Balkans, beforeRussia creating the puppet states like Serbia and Greece and their artificialnations.

Greece puppet state of Russia?
GODS.

 

[Yetos]

It deserves the trash bin.

the whole case deserves thrash can but seems the more we become technologically advanced the more stupid we become all of us.

 

[Zemra]

the whole case deserves thrash can but seems the more we become technologically advanced the more stupid we become all of us.

Yetos did you put me in the ignore list?

 

[Yetos]

@ zemra

no why?

 

[kesi]

Tbh honest there are loanwords that are more persistant in the borrowing nations vocabulary than in the nation they borrowed it from.

There are many words from the greek language that we serbs borrowed and haven't really changed whilst the greeks through the national unification processes have standradised the language.

You get what I'm saying? Let's say you borrow the word dad from the turks (which u did).

Bab - Dad - Bab (ottoman turkish if I'm not totally wrong)

Bab - Dad - Baba (modern turkish)

They standardized it while u didn't.

Shit happen. Albanians did borrow many words from serbs/greeks/latins/turks for a reason. These countries held dominion over modern Albania for a majority of times. Even though u loaned massive words you still have your own substratum and language. So the loanwords are just superficial u dreq

Yes I know Albanian has loan words from all the peoples you mentioned but this specific word origin is not known and how it evolved,this is a matter of linguists who study words to say for certain.

Actually we say "babi" or "baba" for father but we have other words such as Ate (singular) or Eterit (fathers, elders)