Old Prussian (West Baltic) R1a clades

[Tomenable]

I haven't seen anyone separating Slavic and Baltic clades under Z92+.

I would say that most of Z92+ are probably Baltic subclades.

 

[arvistro]

There hasn't been done thorough analysis of Z92+ at a deeper resolution. As a carrier of Z92+, I haven't seen anyone separating Slavic and Baltic clades under Z92+.

This is what user Michal wrote on R1a, he is quite erudite in R1a finesses:
"Z92 has rarely (if ever) been tested in previous research studies, so I doubt such a map exists. However, here is a map (by Igor Rozhanskii) that should help you a bit in this respect: https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer...g.kMX9UHiC_AJ4
(pink - YP569, yellow - YP270, green - CTS9551, grey - unknown/unclustered)

YP270 (including both CTS4648 and its "slightly more Eastern" brother clade YP351) seems to have been associated mostly with the ancient Yotvingians/Sudovians, although I wouldn't exclude its early presence among some other West Baltic and/or East Baltic tribes.

YP569 is commonly considered an Eastern Slavic subclade. IMO, this was likely an initially East Baltic subclade (associated with the Yukhnov culture?) that was relatively early included in the locally expanding Proto-Slavic population, thus becoming a part of the Late Zarubintsy (Pochep)->Kiev->Kolochin cultures before expanding with the Early Slavs (or more precisely with the ancestors of the Eastern Slavs), mostly northward and eastward. As for the East Baltic (Slavicized) Yukhnov culture, I would also see it as associated with some other subclades under both Z92 (like CTS9551) and YP237 (like YP578). As both Lithuanians and Latvians are commonly believed to have arrived to their today's locations from south-east, they could have also included some East Baltic subclades that were present in the neighboring Yukhnov culture, so at least a small fraction of early YP569 members could have never been Slavicized (being associated with the ancient Lithuanians and other East Balts instead). However, in such case it is difficult to explain why the frequency of YP569 among the Latvians is so low. One possible explanation is that those ancient ancestors of Latvians were initially located north (or rather north-east) of the ancestors of Lithuanians, so their contact with both Yukhnov (YP569) and the Sudovian culture (Yotvingians, YP270) was very limited."

 

[lyakh]

What with YP237? It is not under Z92. It is a subclade of R1a-Z280+ CTS1211+ Y35+ CTS3402+. Is it possible that all R-YP237 was initially Baltic, not Slavic?
One of subbranches of YP237 (YP235+ YP234+ YP238+ L365+) can be called "(East) Pomeranian". It is common among Kashubians who live in Eastern Pomerania now.
I am interesting if L365 "possessors" are descendants of slavicised (Western) Balts.

 

[Volat]

Maybe of interest reconstruction of physical appearance of Yotvingians (western Balts) of western Belarus dated to late 10th century.

 

[Galadhorn]

Hi! I belong to R1a > YP350 > Y42739, and my Y-DNA ancestors were probably Yotvingians. I have joinded recently the YFull.

I am this guy who makes the research of J. R. R. Tolkien's genealogy and genetics, who discovered not only that the Tolkiens came to England from Prussia via Gdansk (Danzig), but also that the Tolkiens belong to the YP270 line. You can find my research looking for hashtag TolkienAncestry

At the moment we try to finalize the BIG Y of one of the descendants of the Tolkiens from London < Gdansk < Prussia:

 

[Simonis]

Maybe of interest reconstruction of physical appearance of Yotvingians (western Balts) of western Belarus dated to late 10th century.

Could anyone share where this excerpt was taken from?

 

[kingdavid]

I think we are going to see
A lot of r1a here
Those bam files are out :

ENA Browser

ENA Browser

www.ebi.ac.uk

славяне

docs.google.com

P.s
Sites from: eastern germany, poland, ukraine,
Croatia
I don't know if this paper is published or in a pre-print version though
those samples might be connected to this presentation