Racism in Europe.

oriental said:
Looking at the demographics from polygamy as shown above there is a very high level of unmarried males on the street so women would be in danger of being kidnapped or raped so they have to keep themselves hidden or covered. I think this is the origin of the Hijabs and Burqas.
Click to expand...

Yes, I mentioned before in one of the threads that burka was invented to safe-guard man's property. If you don't see a woman, you won't be tempted much.

I'm pretty sure that polygamy was "invented" by Arabs to increase number of offspring. The main issue was that they were loosing a lot of men during wars, and continues fast expansion of Islam. Thanks to this there were lots of women without man, therefore "wasted" good mothers for potential next generation of warriors. In this case, polygamy increased number of men for war efforts, or workforce in general.

The problem is that in peaceful times it creates imbalance and injustice.
 
Polygamy existed in various cultures before Islam, it's not an 'invention' of Arabs :)
 
I never said it was an Arab invention. I am showing the bad side of polygamy and how it distorts the male-female ratio of singles. In China also men could have four wives which is bad. In the old days the powerful had all the women. In a religious setting it becomes all the more dangerous as it is gives it a "righteous" feeling. Polygamy is narrowing the males genes to a few peole and also creates a form of inbreeding in thought and genetics. So are you in favour of polygamy?
 
I could consider non-religious polygamy :)

And actually I was referring to LeBrok's post :)
 
Oh sorry, I just realized that. You can see that polygamy doubles the population every generation and not an exponential growth as all the females are taken in a particular society. In a mixed society it would initially be exponential till all the females are taken then it will become a doubling process as shown in the table assuming there are equal number of boys and girls born.
 
oriental said:
Generation
 Years
 Total Population
 Males
 Wives
 Frustrated Males without wives









1
 0
 5
 1
 4
2
 20
 16
 2
 8
 6
3
 40
 32
 4
 16
 12
4
 60
 64
 8
 32
 24
5
 80
 128
 16
 64
 48
6
 100
 256
 32
 128
 96
7
 120
 512
 64
 256
 128
8
 140
 1024
 128
 512
 256



Looking at the demographics from polygamy as shown above there is a very high level of unmarried males on the street so women would be in danger of being kidnapped or raped so they have to keep themselves hidden or covered. I think this is the origin of the Hijabs and Burqas.
Click to expand...

Remember though that Mormons also practiced/practice polygamy, but how many cases of violent crimes, kidnapping or rape among them can we quote? And Mormon females don't cover themselves.
 
In the US polygamy is forbidden. A Mormon guy was arrested. However, the British Columbia provincial government in Canada is stupid or afraid to to end polygamy in Bountiful, B.C. I think they are afraid of the Muslims getting into the act. Canada is one of those liberal countries that doesn't know about the dangers of religious polygamy.
 
oriental said:
In the US polygamy is forbidden. A Mormon guy was arrested. However, the British Columbia provincial government in Canada is stupid or afraid to to end polygamy in Bountiful, B.C. I think they are afraid of the Muslims getting into the act. Canada is one of those liberal countries that doesn't know about the dangers of religious polygamy.
Click to expand...
Yes, polygamy is forbidden but on different grounds.
Anyway the point is that violent behaviour of believers apparently has roots in different tenets of religion than polygamy, as the case of Mormons demonstrates.
 
Polygamy in general is no good as it creates imbalances in the population and is very aggressive. However in individual cases of political oppression it may be the only option. Drastic situations do sometimes require drastic actions. Where there is peace and harmony polygamy is the wrong way. In a hostile political situation it is up to those to decide whatever ways and means needed to correct the situation.
 
That is the modern Racism

once was with color, at another time with the possesion of land and income,
today has this face,



PLZ DON"T LET MODERN ISLAM NAZI RACISTS TO PASS LAWS AGAINST FREEDOM OF SPEECH.


in case someone wants to see trailer of the movie, before Islamic states censored it and delete Links to youtube or tottaly forbid it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MAiOEV0v2RM&feature=related
 
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Vallicanus said:
They were certainly idiots but they were useful in Lenin's plans.
Click to expand...
There is so much misinformation on this topic...
First of all, Lenin and many communists see the intellectuals as necessary to begin a revolution. So...I think you're a bit off old chap. Second, this is a passage from a letter that he wrote from loc.gov:

"The intellectual forces of the workers and peasants are growing and getting stronger in their fight to overthrow the
bourgeoisie and their accomplices, the educated classes, thelackeys of capital, who consider themselves the brains of thenation. In fact they are not its brains but its shit. We pay above-average salaries to those "intellectual forces"who want to bring learning to the people (rather than toadying tocapital). That is a fact. We cherish them. That is a fact. Tens of thousands of officers are serving in the Red Army and arewinning in spite of hundreds of traitors. That is a fact. Regarding your frame of mind, I know how to "understand" it(once you asked whether I would understand you). Several times,on Capri and elsewhere, I told you, "You let yourself besurrounded by the worst elements of the bourgeois intelligentsia, and you give in to their whining. You hear and listen to thewail of hundreds of intellectuals about their "terrible"incarceration lasting several weeks, but you do not hear orlisten to the voices of the masses, of millions -- workers andpeasants -- who are threatened by Denikin, Kolchak, Lianozov,Rodzianko, the Krasnaia Gorka (and other Kadet) conspirators. Iquite, quite understand that this is how you can end your letterwith the statement that these "Reds are just as much enemies ofthe people as the Whites" (fighters for the overthrow ofcapitalists and landlords are just as much enemies of the peopleas are the capitalists and the landlords), or even end upbelieving in a tin divinity or in "our father the tsar." I quiteunderstand. Really and truly you will die* if you don't break away fromthis situation with the bourgeois intelligentsia. With all my heart I wish that you would break away as soon as possible."It is obvious there is a distinction between good, Marxist intellectuals and the bourgeois fools. But that is beside the point (though it is representative of your lack of research and degree of misinformation).

As for the polygamy: According to wikipedia, it only accounts for 1-3% of marriages in the Islamic world. Not too many, and nothing that deserves serious consideration here. I suppose, however, I should further my argument to dispel any last thoughts you may have on the matter. According to quranicpath.com, polygamy:

"reading 4:3, we notice the verse begins by laying a clear condition, "If you fear that you will not be just/equitable to the orphans, then marry...". The underlined word "then" is the translation for the word"fa / ف". This term used to mean "in that case / so / then" is connecting the two portion of marrying more than one woman, and being more equitable to orphans, in a conditional manner. Even to an un-trained reader, it is very obvious to notice that Allah is stating here that the verse is 'permitting' another marriage only in order to be more "just / equitable" to orphaned children, in other words, to take care of orphaned children better. Orphaned children who have lost their father need care when their widowed mother is unable to provide for them. How can marrying again solve the problem of helpless orphaned children who are not provided for (e.g. food and shelter)? Ofcourse, it is by marriage to the widowed mother to whom the orphans belong to - who is also is in need of provision. The discussion of orphans and their care continues well into Surah An-Nisa further emphasising that marriage to more than one woman is only permitted in the unique case stated very explicitly within the verse itself."

Lastly, I request interlocutors to use sources as opposed to meaningless propaganda you either heard or formulated a priori any actual facts.

 
So in which category does your position fall in this case? 'good Marxist intellectuals or the bourgeois fools'?
 
"...As for the polygamy: According to wikipedia, it only accounts for 1-3% of marriages in the Islamic world. Not too many, and nothing that deserves serious consideration here. I suppose, however, I should further my argument to dispel any last thoughts you may have on the matter. According to quranicpath.com, polygamy: "
GenerationYearsTotal PopulationMalesWivesFrustrated Males without wives
105140
22016286
3403241612
4606483224
580128166448
61002563212896
712051264256128
81401024128512256
20162521008564
%12.5


Statistics can lie. The above chart with full blown polygamy it shows only 12.5% of the males pratice polygamy. The majority of the males arem't married so are not participating in polygamy.:useless::LOL:
 
oriental said:
"...As for the polygamy: According to wikipedia, it only accounts for 1-3% of marriages in the Islamic world. Not too many, and nothing that deserves serious consideration here. I suppose, however, I should further my argument to dispel any last thoughts you may have on the matter. According to quranicpath.com, polygamy: "
GenerationYearsTotal PopulationMalesWivesFrustrated Males without wives
105140
22016286
3403241612
4606483224
580128166448
61002563212896
712051264256128
81401024128512256
20162521008564
%12.5


Statistics can lie. The above chart with full blown polygamy it shows only 12.5% of the males pratice polygamy. The majority of the males arem't married so are not participating in polygamy.:useless::LOL:
Click to expand...

So basically you have no real sources? Alright then...I think I'm done here. And by the way, Kardu, I'm a Marxist.
 
I suspected so..
 
chizit20092012.jpg




The photo is in another counyty, outside Europe,

I wonder if we have racism in Europe,
what have other countries, with the bless of their goverments,

in photo are beggars in China,
if you want to beg you must be inside a gace.

I still think Europe has the lowest racism in the world,


http://news247.gr/eidiseis/kosmos/n...a_na_mhn_enoxloun_toys_toyristes.1936284.html
 
What the Communists do cannot be classified. However, that picture shows not racism but communism. Those people are Chinese who are migrants from rural to urban areas. The same thing happened in the Soviet Union.

That photo shows they are probably there for protection from theft. They are smiling. :rolleyes:
 
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Yetos said:
Chavlier you are from Iran,
the Problem is that religion can kill cultures,
Iran Is still under Priests command (Ayatollah or something like that spell) yet Iran is miles infront some neighbour countries,
in my country we also had such eras,
thing is why a movie can create such fondamentalism?
Just think such riots in Europe for a movie,
before some decades I lived a simmilar phenomena about a movie against Christian religion (a kazantzakis book) but never with killing people,
that is a good point to understand the limits of different culture and racism,

what I mean?
Who the Hell is that Imam of Al Azhar, Ahmed Al Tayep (maybe wrong spell) who wants the UN to pass an International Law that every one who insult Islam should punished?
What Era we Leave? even in Medieval times such laws did not Exist,

That is Cultural difference that creates Racism,
I am Polytheist, and sometimes I want to run in Nature Naked, but I don't, due to stupid Christians Laws, but closing my mouth is too much,
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I saw it with my own eyes, thought to believe religion is root of all, but... question is... it is culture.
you see every culture have different interpretation of religion.
this is far beyond proven to me, I see it everyday.
these people, since past, had a "morbid" culture; emphasizing on sacrifice, self-pity, superfacial innocence and always playing "weak people" part instead of facing problems themselves and be "potent people".
shia, is one of two major sub religion of islam; it was first made, and still is used, as means to Arabs and Turks in west of country and to distinguish themselves politically.

no one really sure why revolution started, everything was fine, sure shah was evil to some degree, but no one revolutionized for this, a islamic government.
there were no real opposition from people back then because they were deeply religious themselves, also as well lacking education and being ignorant of history (to know what horrid things religious government just can condemn), politics (they lived and still live in modern era, and economy-supporting government is more essential than ever for our country -not necessary capitalism) and their own rights (freedom of speech, equality...people still being treated as horde, and like animals, despite SOME OF US have different views, have dreams, have desire to be productive in our OWN way, but who cares?...)

no matter even type of government comes, people are still the same...cultureless.
Aristotle was right, "every nation has government it deserves."


about movie, I watched it and impression was .... nothing!
I mean, how the hell muslims got so angry about such stupid movie??? I thought it was comedy?! I mean... did really a innocent person who isn't related to movie, just got killed for nothing?! ... I was so pissed, how could they riot on such stupid film? I mean by looking at it, it can force to believe Mohammad is like what movie says, because movie has hard time convincing, it humiliates itself!
also I really hate Germans for defending such pathetic film, call it "artistic"... how hypocrite! I lost faith in Germans!

I am truly sorry for death of a innocent person.
in Iran, no one neither rioted nor celebrated, had lived under opression of a islamic government already people got sick of these bullshits and not giving a damn about it... we struggle with increasing expenses and poor economy...we don't have time over some stupid film.

the riot itself was humiliating enough for muslims; they too humiliate themselves.
to be such insecure, that a movie can "threats" the VERY FOUNDATION OF ISLAM>>> OH MY GOD, ALLUH O AKBAR, DEATH ON ANY INFIDELS ... and such bullshits that I even laugh. XDDD

do they call themselves muslim? Islam is about peace and harmonious living with others.

Mohammad is a prophet who is holy enough to need no defense. he is filled with reverence yet these people act like there is something fishy about Islam. that needs to be defended or it's so pathetic and stupid religion that leaves no option for its believers other than this sort of action, rioting. no no no real Islam isn't just that!
it has lot to do with culture than religion itself... Islamic culture, which isn't authentically prompted from Islam itself but rather interpretation they had about Islam every society and what they put their own customs on Islam.
it made people think certain ways, problem is people should modify their mindset.

no problem on wrong spelling, honestly I don't give a damn who the hell are they either...bunch of zealous freak who gave us bad name, why should I care about them?!

this is wrong, and no such laws should be allowed. they think they defend the faith but what they do is to destroying it.
since when in history of mankind, men didn't find themselves in need of a good critique.
I honestly tell you what all Muslims think and what Islam is to itself; it is most true and last religion of all. this is the reason for all recent acts. Islam was successor of Christianity, just as well Christ himself was to put an end to Jewish rules.
but they all just fantasize and actually don't care about means. Buddhism has attracted more people than Islam did (although it has same past brutal history just like all religions, today it is at its most peaceful state), and let's say they convert all to Islam... what good will it do if all they think is everything is right from beginning.
just like fall of catholic church in enlightenment age, Islam is dooming itself for not welcoming critiques, and I'm not talking this stupid movie, but something with philosophical and constructive approach.

Islam is ... really Arab-ilized, that when people think of Islam they think of Arabs. but it have different looks in various cultures of Asia, some like mine, Turkmens, have very peaceful state of religion, just praying, fasting and that's all, and we have religious celebration occasionally, like eid-e-fetr which is like your thanksgiving and eid-e-gorban which is like your Christmas.

since we all know religion is influenced by culture, authorities and most be flexible to needs of time, it is as criticiz-able as other human matters are.

even in Medieval times such laws did not Exist
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... inquisition.


how yes no 3 said:
being muslim is not a problem, most religions (including islam) do not preach bad things... islam is in essence very similar to Christianity...

problem is that underdeveloped individuals will make primitive belief system of any religion or thought system...
the way that underdeveloped individuals see the world is in black and white division of type "us and them"... there are no indivduals fellow humans for a person whose mind is poisoned with group idolatry....racist or fanatics of any kind do not see individual people, they only see group (race, ideology, nation, religion) members and non group members...

when on 9/11 you see celebration in muslim countries, it is for them not at all about innocent individuals who are killed, it is about anti-group (in this case USA) who messes up with their group (in this case islamic countries) being punched back in the nose....
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yes, problem is underdeveloped people. kick them out of the Europe before they all give us a bad name.

NOOOOO! we didn't celebrated! that's sick!

Yetos said:
I want to ask Questions to all of you,

Do you accept with an International Law that forbids speaking against any religion?

How do you feel if the USA Ambassador got Killed by a Muslim in an European country riots?

How do you feel that one day your daughter must wear dresses that she does not want to, cause of a religious law in the city,

How do you feel if you can be accused of insulting a religion in an Academic discuss inside a lecture in a University?
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-no, since everything is questionable, even religion.

-I feel truly sorry. though I think it's extremists work who took advantage of riot.

-I live under such laws; I truly feel sorry for our girls in country. beauty hidden, sexes distanced and ...total annoying from what I see in woman, I mean, man! to wear such annoying thing in summer?!
though scarf is okay, and if not forced. how lovely some women look imagine, in winter, in their cozy coat and cute little scarfs, treading through market, buying stuff for home.

-I will begin to feel HOW stupid authority IS! when something is wrong something is wrong. nothing is too sacred.

oriental said:
They are smiling. :rolleyes:
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LOL
(though the mom was smiling at her grand kid lol)
 
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