So did Russia invade Ukraine, yes or no?
I wasn't convincing myself. My position is well known in many posts here. I listed the evidence for you.
In case you missed it, yes Russia actively supports rebels with troops and equipment. So yes, they invaded Ukraine.
Did you miss that Russian troops are already, and not hiding, in Cinema, a part of Ukraine? I'm sure you will excuse this behaviour too.
This is not relevant since every country has the right to move it's troops wherever it wants within it's own territory. Especially if a huge neighbour country experiences a coup by hostile russophobes who start attacking their russiphile population, backed by a military organization which keeps breaking promises for 20 years.
Switzerland recently prepared it's army for a french attack, can you imagine.
So did these 100000 Russian troops invade Ukraine?
Swiss scenario is highly hypothetical for the exercise. Russian troops build up "coincidentally" coincides with Russian rebel fighters area. Please, be more objective. Isn't it handy to have troops there to send them into rebel area any time there is a need?
I hope, when the dust settles in the future and we know the truth from documents, you will bravely come back to this thread and state how wrong you were.
I know these pictures, this one in particular.
These pictures don't answer the most important question: whom these columns belong, the Ukrainian army, the Rebels or the Russian army. Some are moving west and some east.
Who would use unmarked units inside Ukraine, especially deep in the rebel zone?
I have a feeling that until you go their and hear the truth from russian soldier mouth or Putin himself will confirm that troops are in Ukraine, you won't believe the overwhelming evidence.
It looks like a duck, it walks and quacks like a duck, but for you it is unidentified object.
Don't need to ask the rebels, they handed it over already to Farnborough, England. The receivers confirmed that the box was intact and sealed. The recent dutch report did not mention in the slightest who shot. But the "community" knew already immediately after it happened that Russia has to be sanctioned. This is irresponsible. The media created pressure upon EU politicians to harm both, EU and Russia.
Then, why did you asked, what happened to the black box?
That's what was promised by Genscher 1990 in Germany. It was also common sense that there is no need of NATO expansion because the Soviet threat is gone. Read the article from foreign affairs which I posted. So why did NATO change it's mind? Expansionist ambitions perhaps?
The Nato is not in Ukraine yet, not even close, and Crimea and East Russia is invaded by Putin. Keeping up the promise? In case you missed one detail, Nato membership is voluntary, unlike Warsaw pact was. It is up to two sides to agree upon this relationship. It is legal to join Nato. Invading another country is not.
NATO approached Russia for 20 years and finally reached it's borders by creating a hostile russophobe coup.
Why Russia don't want to join Nato or EU, be a friend and a big helpful brother instead?
You seriously expect Russia to stay calm? If yes, we can stop discussing.
Every move by Putin was entirely defensive.
Even Obama admitted in the CNN interview last Sunday that Putin had no ambitions about Crimea because he was totally surprised by the regime change which "we" (Obama) did, lol.
Now compare that to the narrative in western mainstream media. We have been fooled all the time, and I told you so.
Oh yes, Putin panicked and didn't do the best moves. Or ok moves but he doesn't like the consequences. It doesn't mean that what he did was legal, smart, excusable, or whatever. What is, it is, you don't need to protect Russia and Putin. At least lets call the thing the way they are. I was critical about legality, tactics and smarts of Bush junior during Iraq war. I was pro American, but I could call the things by their real names.
Again, where is the result of this choice? Me thinks at least east Ukrainians beg to differ. Yet NATO is meddling there, toppling a democratically elected government. Now who has expansionist ambitions?
Why is Nato not mendling in Finland? Why isn't it pure Ukrainian choice? You don't believe that Ukrainians are smart enough to make their own decisions? Why do you think that Ukrainians need to be controlled by a foreign power? It really borders with conspiracy theory. Everything needs to be controlled.
Don't you see that this type of Russian thinking of controlling everything is pushing other countries away from Russia. It is scary to have a control freak as a friend.
You can't be serious. Biggest land mass with just 200000 inhabitants and a little bit oil, gas, uranium, palladium, gold.
Wages have increased ten-fold since Putin is in power, debt has decreased to 12% to GDB (compare that to western debt levels), foreign cash savings suffice to pay the debt multiple times, and finally in addition yet the resource wealth.
Russia has still many problems for sure, but claiming that it is less than a glittering jack pot is ridiculous.
And yet with such resources and big population it is 3 trillion dollar economy. EU is 16, US 15, China 13, Japan 5, Germany 4. Russians considered themselves equal if not stronger than US. It must really hurt russian proud now, isn't it? On grounds of these hurt feelings, Putin was elected. He's job is to restore Russian pride. To bad he doesn't know any other way but the KGB way, lie, deceive and bully around.
Now please explain which countries Russia bullied. Georgia attacked Russian troops in Abkhasia because Saakashvili thought NATO would help him. Chechnya war was bad, but it is inside Russia and was started by Yelsin.
You better start with Soviet Union. Sins of Russia were not counseled with fall of Soviet Union. Nobody even heard "I'm sorry" to start a new friendship with". I guess in your school you were not taught about excesses of Soviet Union, therefore it should be brought to your attention that what was done still hurts many, but Russia is acting innocent and oblivious, and never faced the past.
This is not reversed to what I said, it is supportive. As I said, Russia has no incentive to annex or even conquer east Ukraine, and you provide an additional argument. Russia needs this buffer to protect it's border. That's what Putin tried to express: he could take Kiev in two weeks, but he doesn't.
Exactly what bully would say to a "friend". You still act surprised that countries act as Russophobes? Would you say to your wife or a friend "I could smash your face if I really wanted to, but I won't", and expect understanding and friendship?
This is the path to WW3 because Russia has no room where to step back without losing and eventually breaking-up into small pieces,
For god sake, just join the world. Nobody wants to attack and conquer you. Don't be psychotic. Make friends.
