The genomic history of the Aegean palatial civilizations.

[Angela]

I actually agree with most what you've said, but you sometimes misunderstand what I try to bring across. Why you, me and others here, are befuddled is the fact, that the skin color prediction doesn't match the accounts of Ancient Greeks about their coloration. Nobody here would be surprised about this result if the Ancient Greeks would claim they were as dark as the Ethiopians or compared themselves to them. Ancient Greeks saw super pale Northern Europeans, moderately dark Egyptians and extremely dark Ethiopians. Hence, they were well aware of all the shades and hues of all kinds of people. They took dark to very dark, and pale to very pale people as an example, to stress their intermediate complexion. Plus, the Greeks talked about their females and Barbarians being pale/white. So, I'm discussing with you and others here because I try to connect the dots, thus make sense out the fact, that there is a discrepancy between the self-description of the Ancient Greeks in terms of their complexion and the result from this study.

I agree, although if you go and look at the Hirisplex examples of their skin shade system, dark is not very dark.

Still, as I said, I agree.

 

[Angela]

Any idea why these results seem to be different to the PCA and other results?

Figure S4 Genetic affinities between BA Aegeans compared to other present-day Eurasian populations.

For each case, we show the geographic distribution of f3 (warmer colors represent greater sharing between populations X and Y).

Beside each map, we plot the f3 values for the 15 populations that are most closely related to each of the populations in Y.

This is an F3 analysis, not admixture. I provided a link which explains the differences between F3, F4 etc. Given that Log 4 is about 50% steppe, someplace like England or Germany or Norway does make more sense to me.

 

[Angela]

Why is the word *** censored? "***mentation"

Inviato dal mio POT-LX1T utilizzando Tapatalk

Because the woke idiots have taken control of google and most platforms. Good luck trying to find a paper on population genetics with regard to ***mentation on google. They're censored.

I've switched to Bing, but who knows how long they'll remain sane.

 

[Philjames100]

This is an F3 analysis, not admixture. I provided a link which explains the differences between F3, F4 etc. Given that Log 4 is about 50% steppe, someplace like England or Germany or Norway does make more sense to me.

So do you think f3 is more accurate in this case?


'Outgroup F3 statistics are a measure of how closely two populations are related with each other... It is thus a similarity measure: The higher the statistic, the more genetically similar A and B are to one another.'

https://compvar-workshop.readthedocs.io/en/latest/contents/03_f3stats/f3stats.html

 

[Jovialis]

Any idea why these results seem to be different to the PCA and other results?

Figure S4 Genetic affinities between BA Aegeans compared to other present-day Eurasian populations.

For each case, we show the geographic distribution of f3 (warmer colors represent greater sharing between populations X and Y).

Beside each map, we plot the f3 values for the 15 populations that are most closely related to each of the populations in Y.

Here is their genetic distance, which does seem very far.

[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]MBA_Helladic_Logkas:Log04[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8600FF, align: right"]26.07227071[/TD]
[TD]Scottish[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #0000FF, align: right"]43.55175427[/TD]
[TD]Lithuanian

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[Cato]

Because the woke idiots have taken control of google and most platforms. Good luck trying to find a paper on population genetics with regard to ***mentation on google. They're censored.

I've switched to Bing, but who knows how long they'll remain sane.

Thanks

Inviato dal mio POT-LX1T utilizzando Tapatalk

 

[Jovialis]

Here is their genetic distance, which does seem very far.

[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]MBA_Helladic_Logkas:Log04[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8600FF, align: right"]26.07227071[/TD]
[TD]Scottish[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #0000FF, align: right"]43.55175427[/TD]
[TD]Lithuanian
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Eurogenes K13 shows similar results:

[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]Log04_Helladic-Logkas-MBA[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #0000FF, align: right"]30.98066655[/TD]
[TD]Scottish[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #0000FF, align: right"]42.89642992[/TD]
[TD]Lithuanian

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[Jovialis]

Here is Log04 using the Ancient Ethnicities Analyzer sample sets for Dodecad K12b. I have omitted EMBA_Greece, since it is a average with the sample in and of itself in it. I also only used samples prior to the Bronze Age:

[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]MBA_Helladic_Logkas:Log04[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8AFF00, align: right"]4.05551446[/TD]
[TD]49.20% Minoan_Greece_(n=10) + 50.80% Western_Corded_Ware_(n=17)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #93FF00, align: right"]4.32742922[/TD]
[TD]30.80% Chalcolithic_Anatolia_(n=35) + 69.20% Bell_Beaker_Bavaria/Saxony_(n=20)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #94FF00, align: right"]4.35235309[/TD]
[TD]28.20% Chalcolithic_Anatolia_(n=35) + 71.80% Bell_Beaker_Poland_(n=6)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #96FF00, align: right"]4.42282822[/TD]
[TD]57.80% MN_Westphalia_(Megalithic_Wartberg)_(n=6) + 42.20% Chalcolithic_Northwest_Caucasus_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A3FF00, align: right"]4.79227742[/TD]
[TD]55.60% MN_Westphalia_(Megalithic_Wartberg)_(n=6) + 44.40% Kura-Araxes_culture_(n=8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A4FF00, align: right"]4.83485120[/TD]
[TD]49.60% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 50.40% Western_Corded_Ware_(n=17)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A5FF00, align: right"]4.84387292[/TD]
[TD]55.60% Minoan_Greece_(n=10) + 44.40% Eastern_Corded_Ware_(n=8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A6FF00, align: right"]4.87434178[/TD]
[TD]49.40% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3) + 50.60% Western_Corded_Ware_(n=17)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #AFFF00, align: right"]5.14965055[/TD]
[TD]34.20% Chalcolithic_Anatolia_(n=35) + 65.80% Bell_Beaker_Czechia_(n=15)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B1FF00, align: right"]5.19833457[/TD]
[TD]55.80% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3) + 44.20% Eastern_Corded_Ware_(n=8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BAFF00, align: right"]5.46720224[/TD]
[TD]20.40% Chalcolithic_Anatolia_(n=35) + 79.60% Bell_Beaker_Hungary_(n=6)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C2FF00, align: right"]5.71054814[/TD]
[TD]47.40% Minoan_Greece_(n=10) + 52.60% Battle-Axe_culture_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C2FF00, align: right"]5.71379690[/TD]
[TD]56.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 44.00% Eastern_Corded_Ware_(n=8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C5FF00, align: right"]5.78136591[/TD]
[TD]31.60% Chalcolithic_North_Levant_(n=6) + 68.40% Bell_Beaker_Bavaria/Saxony_(n=20)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C5FF00, align: right"]5.79376873[/TD]
[TD]32.60% Chalcolithic_Anatolia_(n=35) + 67.40% Bell_Beaker_Gaul_(n=13)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CBFF00, align: right"]5.96151263[/TD]
[TD]17.80% Chalcolithic_Northwest_Caucasus_(n=3) + 82.20% Bell_Beaker_Hungary_(n=6)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CCFF00, align: right"]6.00558714[/TD]
[TD]27.40% Chalcolithic_Azerbaijan_(n=4) + 72.60% Bell_Beaker_Poland_(n=6)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CDFF00, align: right"]6.02101976[/TD]
[TD]63.80% Pre-Pottery_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=8) + 36.20% Khvalynsk_culture_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #CEFF00, align: right"]6.04999866[/TD]
[TD]35.20% Chalcolithic_North_Levant_(n=6) + 64.80% Bell_Beaker_Czechia_(n=15)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #D9FF00, align: right"]6.38082750[/TD]
[TD]81.00% Bell_Beaker_Hungary_(n=6) + 19.00% Kura-Araxes_culture_(n=8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #D9FF00, align: right"]6.38690853[/TD]
[TD]34.00% Mesolithic_Volga-Ural_(n=2) + 66.00% Pre-Pottery_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DAFF00, align: right"]6.39897383[/TD]
[TD]59.40% Pre-Pottery_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=8) + 40.60% Yamna_culture_(n=16)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DEFF00, align: right"]6.54373606[/TD]
[TD]48.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 52.00% Battle-Axe_culture_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #DFFF00, align: right"]6.55968204[/TD]
[TD]19.40% Chalcolithic_Azerbaijan_(n=4) + 80.60% Bell_Beaker_Hungary_(n=6)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #E0FF00, align: right"]6.60249184[/TD]
[TD]53.60% Bell_Beaker_Netherlands_(n=7) + 46.40% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[Jovialis]

Here is Log02 using the same parameters:

[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]MBA_Helladic_Logkas:Log02[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #55FF00, align: right"]2.48578595[/TD]
[TD]28.60% Neolithic_Ukraine_(n=12) + 71.40% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #57FF00, align: right"]2.54935225[/TD]
[TD]29.60% Mesolithic_Baltic_Scandinavia_(SHG)_(n=31) + 70.40% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #5BFF00, align: right"]2.67591254[/TD]
[TD]28.40% Mesolithic_Ukraine_(n=7) + 71.60% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #6BFF00, align: right"]3.14827590[/TD]
[TD]30.20% Neolithic_Latvia_(n=4) + 69.80% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #73FF00, align: right"]3.37486853[/TD]
[TD]30.20% Neolithic_Lithuania_Narva_culture_(n=4) + 69.80% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #88FF00, align: right"]3.99730565[/TD]
[TD]32.00% Mesolithic_Balkans_HG_(n=43) + 68.00% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8CFF00, align: right"]4.12687861[/TD]
[TD]27.40% Mesolithic_Northwest_Russia_(n=4) + 72.60% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #90FF00, align: right"]4.22228530[/TD]
[TD]27.40% Mesolithic_Northwest_Russia_(n=4) + 72.60% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #91FF00, align: right"]4.27831093[/TD]
[TD]28.20% Mesolithic_Ukraine_(n=7) + 71.80% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #98FF00, align: right"]4.46740777[/TD]
[TD]72.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 28.00% Neolithic_Ukraine_(n=12)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9AFF00, align: right"]4.51630287[/TD]
[TD]29.00% Mesolithic_Baltic_Scandinavia_(SHG)_(n=31) + 71.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9AFF00, align: right"]4.54172493[/TD]
[TD]27.80% Mesolithic_Ukraine_(n=7) + 72.20% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9CFF00, align: right"]4.57468244[/TD]
[TD]71.40% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3) + 28.60% Neolithic_Ukraine_(n=12)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A3FF00, align: right"]4.79669019[/TD]
[TD]27.80% Mesolithic_Volga-Ural_(n=2) + 72.20% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A9FF00, align: right"]4.96434435[/TD]
[TD]70.40% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 29.60% Neolithic_Lithuania_Narva_culture_(n=4)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #AFFF00, align: right"]5.13790525[/TD]
[TD]29.40% Mesolithic_Baltic_Scandinavia_(SHG)_(n=31) + 70.60% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B3FF00, align: right"]5.26229683[/TD]
[TD]27.80% Mesolithic_Volga-Ural_(n=2) + 72.20% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B6FF00, align: right"]5.35003628[/TD]
[TD]26.80% Mesolithic_Northwest_Russia_(n=4) + 73.20% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B7FF00, align: right"]5.37347791[/TD]
[TD]66.20% Minoan_Greece_(n=10) + 33.80% Eastern_Corded_Ware_(n=8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B7FF00, align: right"]5.38487045[/TD]
[TD]70.60% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 29.40% Neolithic_Latvia_(n=4)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B8FF00, align: right"]5.42140579[/TD]
[TD]48.80% Chalcolithic_North_Levant_(n=6) + 51.20% Bell_Beaker_Czechia_(n=15)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BBFF00, align: right"]5.48576804[/TD]
[TD]70.00% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3) + 30.00% Neolithic_Latvia_(n=4)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BEFF00, align: right"]5.57399731[/TD]
[TD]31.40% Mesolithic_Balkans_HG_(n=43) + 68.60% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BFFF00, align: right"]5.60900699[/TD]
[TD]46.80% MN_Westphalia_(Megalithic_Wartberg)_(n=6) + 53.20% Chalcolithic_Anatolia_(n=35)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C1FF00, align: right"]5.67090951[/TD]
[TD]61.40% Minoan_Greece_(n=10) + 38.60% Western_Corded_Ware_(n=17)

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[Jovialis]

Finally, here is the Early Bronze Age Helladic:

[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]EBA_Helladic_Manika:Mik15[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #37FF00, align: right"]1.61010098[/TD]
[TD]92.40% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 7.60% Chalcolithic_Iberia_(n=62)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #37FF00, align: right"]1.62160649[/TD]
[TD]91.20% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 8.80% Megalithic_Europe_(n=24)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #38FF00, align: right"]1.63866104[/TD]
[TD]90.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 10.00% Chalcolithic_BB_Sardinia_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #38FF00, align: right"]1.65156217[/TD]
[TD]92.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 8.00% Neolithic_Britain_(n=62)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #38FF00, align: right"]1.65234286[/TD]
[TD]92.60% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 7.40% Bell_Beaker_Iberia_(n=11)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #39FF00, align: right"]1.67178106[/TD]
[TD]91.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 9.00% Late_Neolithic_Switzerland_(n=58)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #3BFF00, align: right"]1.72194235[/TD]
[TD]92.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 8.00% Middle_Late_Neolithic_Spain_(n=12)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #3BFF00, align: right"]1.73119949[/TD]
[TD]90.20% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 9.80% Middle_Neolithic_France_(n=19)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #3DFF00, align: right"]1.78939834[/TD]
[TD]92.40% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 7.60% Globular_Amphora_culture_(n=6)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #3FFF00, align: right"]1.85073255[/TD]
[TD]85.40% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 14.60% Late_Chalcolithic_Baden_culture_(n=14)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #40FF00, align: right"]1.87866617[/TD]
[TD]4.00% Epipaleolithic_Magreb_(Iberomaurusians)_(n=5) + 96.00% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #40FF00, align: right"]1.88288829[/TD]
[TD]92.20% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 7.80% CA_Remedello_culture_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #45FF00, align: right"]2.02275718[/TD]
[TD]91.20% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 8.80% Middle_Neolithic_Sardinia_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #45FF00, align: right"]2.03488753[/TD]
[TD]80.60% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 19.40% Early_Neolithic_Starcevo_culture_(n=8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #45FF00, align: right"]2.04197772[/TD]
[TD]84.60% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 15.40% EN_Alfold_Linear_Pottery_culture_(n=20)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #46FF00, align: right"]2.04488044[/TD]
[TD]80.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 20.00% LN_Lengyel_culture_(n=8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #46FF00, align: right"]2.05656394[/TD]
[TD]84.60% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 15.40% Middle_Neolithic_Sicily_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #46FF00, align: right"]2.05715270[/TD]
[TD]89.40% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 10.60% Cucuteni-Trypillian_culture_(n=4)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #47FF00, align: right"]2.09633678[/TD]
[TD]84.40% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 15.60% Middle_Chalcolithic_Hungary_(n=9)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #47FF00, align: right"]2.10271711[/TD]
[TD]77.80% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 22.20% Chalcolithic_Bulgaria_(n=9)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #48FF00, align: right"]2.13077473[/TD]
[TD]92.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 8.00% Early_Neolithic_Spain_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #4BFF00, align: right"]2.19451927[/TD]
[TD]21.80% Pre-Pottery_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=8) + 78.20% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #4DFF00, align: right"]2.27480436[/TD]
[TD]83.80% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 16.20% Early_Neolithic_Italy_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #4EFF00, align: right"]2.28583847[/TD]
[TD]95.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 5.00% MN_Westphalia_(Megalithic_Wartberg)_(n=6)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #4FFF00, align: right"]2.31740703[/TD]
[TD]83.40% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 16.60% LN_Tisza-Sopot_culture_(n=11)

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[Archetype0ne]

Here is Log02 using the same parameters:

[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]MBA_Helladic_Logkas:Log02[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #55FF00, align: right"]2.48578595[/TD]
[TD]28.60% Neolithic_Ukraine_(n=12) + 71.40% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #57FF00, align: right"]2.54935225[/TD]
[TD]29.60% Mesolithic_Baltic_Scandinavia_(SHG)_(n=31) + 70.40% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #5BFF00, align: right"]2.67591254[/TD]
[TD]28.40% Mesolithic_Ukraine_(n=7) + 71.60% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #6BFF00, align: right"]3.14827590[/TD]
[TD]30.20% Neolithic_Latvia_(n=4) + 69.80% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #73FF00, align: right"]3.37486853[/TD]
[TD]30.20% Neolithic_Lithuania_Narva_culture_(n=4) + 69.80% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #88FF00, align: right"]3.99730565[/TD]
[TD]32.00% Mesolithic_Balkans_HG_(n=43) + 68.00% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #8CFF00, align: right"]4.12687861[/TD]
[TD]27.40% Mesolithic_Northwest_Russia_(n=4) + 72.60% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #90FF00, align: right"]4.22228530[/TD]
[TD]27.40% Mesolithic_Northwest_Russia_(n=4) + 72.60% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #91FF00, align: right"]4.27831093[/TD]
[TD]28.20% Mesolithic_Ukraine_(n=7) + 71.80% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #98FF00, align: right"]4.46740777[/TD]
[TD]72.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 28.00% Neolithic_Ukraine_(n=12)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9AFF00, align: right"]4.51630287[/TD]
[TD]29.00% Mesolithic_Baltic_Scandinavia_(SHG)_(n=31) + 71.00% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9AFF00, align: right"]4.54172493[/TD]
[TD]27.80% Mesolithic_Ukraine_(n=7) + 72.20% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #9CFF00, align: right"]4.57468244[/TD]
[TD]71.40% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3) + 28.60% Neolithic_Ukraine_(n=12)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A3FF00, align: right"]4.79669019[/TD]
[TD]27.80% Mesolithic_Volga-Ural_(n=2) + 72.20% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #A9FF00, align: right"]4.96434435[/TD]
[TD]70.40% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 29.60% Neolithic_Lithuania_Narva_culture_(n=4)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #AFFF00, align: right"]5.13790525[/TD]
[TD]29.40% Mesolithic_Baltic_Scandinavia_(SHG)_(n=31) + 70.60% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B3FF00, align: right"]5.26229683[/TD]
[TD]27.80% Mesolithic_Volga-Ural_(n=2) + 72.20% Minoan_Greece_(n=10)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B6FF00, align: right"]5.35003628[/TD]
[TD]26.80% Mesolithic_Northwest_Russia_(n=4) + 73.20% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B7FF00, align: right"]5.37347791[/TD]
[TD]66.20% Minoan_Greece_(n=10) + 33.80% Eastern_Corded_Ware_(n=8)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B7FF00, align: right"]5.38487045[/TD]
[TD]70.60% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7) + 29.40% Neolithic_Latvia_(n=4)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #B8FF00, align: right"]5.42140579[/TD]
[TD]48.80% Chalcolithic_North_Levant_(n=6) + 51.20% Bell_Beaker_Czechia_(n=15)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BBFF00, align: right"]5.48576804[/TD]
[TD]70.00% Early_Neolithic_Greece_(n=3) + 30.00% Neolithic_Latvia_(n=4)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BEFF00, align: right"]5.57399731[/TD]
[TD]31.40% Mesolithic_Balkans_HG_(n=43) + 68.60% Early_Neolithic_Anatolia_(n=7)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #BFFF00, align: right"]5.60900699[/TD]
[TD]46.80% MN_Westphalia_(Megalithic_Wartberg)_(n=6) + 53.20% Chalcolithic_Anatolia_(n=35)[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #C1FF00, align: right"]5.67090951[/TD]
[TD]61.40% Minoan_Greece_(n=10) + 38.60% Western_Corded_Ware_(n=17)
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

This might be a dumb question. But does Neolithic Ukraine have any steppe in it?

 

[Ailchu]

That's because modern Greeks are not that swarthy as people pretend them to be. The same goes for Italians or Spaniards. That said, if the phenotype prediction from this study is 100% correct, that would make BA Greeks a lot darker than regular Middle Easterners or North Africans. If I remember correctly there was a phenotype prediction for individuals from the Roman paper here, and they turned out not be particularly swarthy.

it would be a lot clearer if we had the genotypes. looked through the supplements but couldn't find them. if they were not homozygous for 45A2 their ***mentation probably was darker than regular modern people from near east.

 

[Jovialis]

This might be a dumb question. But does Neolithic Ukraine have any steppe in it?

Not a dumb question,

They fall between, EHG and WHG.

Steppe has a lot more CHG:

The Neolithic Transition in the Baltic Was Not Driven by Admixture with Early European Farmers - ScienceDirect

 

[Philjames100]

Eurogenes K13 shows similar results:

[TABLE="class: distances"]
[TR]
[TH="align: right"]Distance to:[/TH]
[TH="align: left"]Log04_Helladic-Logkas-MBA[/TH]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #0000FF, align: right"]30.98066655[/TD]
[TD]Scottish[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD="bgcolor: #0000FF, align: right"]42.89642992[/TD]
[TD]Lithuanian
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

What do you think the reason is for the difference between these results and the f3 statistics in the paper?

 

[Angela]

It's there:

View attachment 12675

Click to enlarge.

 

[Jovialis]

What do you think the reason is for the difference between these results and the f3 statistics in the paper?

TBH, I am not familiar with that tool. It could be worth e-mailing the author to inquire.

 

[Philjames100]

It's there:

View attachment 12675

Click to enlarge.

Attachment doesn't work.

 

[Jovialis]

Attachment doesn't work.

 

[Duarte]

https://ars.els-cdn.com/content/image/1-s2.0-S0092867421003706-mmc2.xlsx

 

[ThirdTerm]

The three BA samples carried SLC24A5 and SLC45A2 typical among modern Europeans today. However, these individuals also carried OCA2, which is common among East Asians, and ASIP, which is associated with darker skin color in African Americans. This may be why the study's authors reached the following conclusion.

Using genotype data, we predicted that Pta08, Kou01, and Log02 most likely had brown eyes, dark brown to black hair, and dark skin (Table S1; STAR Methods). These predictions match the visual representations of male individuals from BA wall paintings of Minoan Crete for hair and eye color. The eye and hair color predictions were similar to those from later periods of the Aegean BA (Lazaridis et al., 2017). Although the overall prediction for all three individuals was of dark skin, they also all carried alleles strongly associated with lighter skin color (rs1426654 in the gene SLC24A5, and rs16891982 in SLC45A2) (Mathieson et al., 2015).