how yes no 2
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http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Strabo/16A*.htmlIt seems that the name of the Syrians extended not only from Babylonia to the Gulf of Issus, but also in ancient times from this gulf to the Euxine. At any rate, both tribes of the Cappadocians, both those near the Taurus and those near the Pontus, have to the present time been called "White Syrians,"3 as though some Syrians were black, these being the Syrians who live outside the Taurus; and when I say "Taurus," I am extending the name as far as the Amanus.
there are Syrians and white Syrians..where does distinction come from?
while white Syrians I related to I2a-din and Cimmerians/Gomer, question is who were other Syrians genetically... J2? E-V13?
Gomer is ancestor of all germanian people... among them are also tribes such as Goths, Hatti.. perhaps Getae were also Germanic....
now, look at this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gutian_dynasty_of_SumerThe Gutian dynasty came to power in Mesopotamia around 2150 BC (short chronology), by destabilising Akkad, according to the Sumerian kinglist at the end of the reign of king Ur-Utu (or Lugal-melem) of Uruk. They reigned for perhaps around one century (copies of the kinglist vary between 25 and 124 years; 91 years is often quoted as probable). The dynasty was succeeded by the 3rd dynasty of Ur.
The Gutian people (Guti) were native to Gutium, presumably in the central Zagros Mountains; almost nothing is known about their origins.
so, Gutians from Zagros mountains were ruling over Sumer for 100 years or more...
Guti = Goti... = perhaps Hatti that were in Asia minor before Hittite...
pay attention to this
in north mythology Hati = giant wolf
in turkish language Kurt = wolf
interestingly, Hati Hróðvitnisson it is the wolf that chases the moon...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hati_HróðvitnissonIn Norse mythology, Hati Hróðvitnisson (first name meaning "He Who Hates, Enemy"[1]) is a wolf that according to Gylfaginning chases the Moon across the night sky, just as the wolf Sköll chases the Sun during the day, until the time of Ragnarök when they will swallow these heavenly bodies, after which Fenrir will break free from his bonds and kill Odin.
Hati's surname is Hróðvitnisson, attested in both Grímnismál and Gylfaginning, which indicates that he is the son of Fenrir, whose alternate name is Hróðvitnir ("Famous Wolf").
note that possible origin of tribal name of serbs is moon as in Slavic "srp" (= crescent, sickle) and in mongolian sar (moon, crescent)
east Germanic Hiri are known to be spooky night warriors...
they are coupled with Scirii, Sciri, Scirians, Skirii, Skiri or Skirians
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scirii
whose tribal name Scirians is just coruption of Serians... same as Sclaveni for Sloveni... or Scordisci for celtic version of Serdi
seri and hurri are paired bulls that represent day and night in Asia minor mythology... again pair, and hurri related to dark, and seri to light though daylight and not moonlight...
seri is also name that comes from serians/sumerians... while hurri might be related to Hurrians
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurrians
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bull_(mythology)The sacred bull of the Hattians, whose elaborate standards were found at Alaca Höyük alongside those of the sacred stag, survived in the Hurrian and Hittite mythologies as Seri and Hurri (Day and Night)—the bulls who carried the weather god Teshub on their backs or in his chariot, and grazed on the ruins of cities.[2]
back to Gutians ruling over Sumer
100 years of ruling a state is enough to begin identifying with its name...
thus Gutians who rulled over Sumer became white-Syrians and Cimmerians (=Sumerians)..they came from north so they probably had somewhat lighter complexion than original Sumerians / Syrians... hence white-Syrians..
so, I wouldnot exclude Goths being I2a-din as well.... perhaps a branch that didnot become white Syrians. kept name Guti..
in fact, tribal names are sometimes wrongly transcribed in non native languages....
let's play with word Guti....
in slavic similar word is ljuti = angry ones
(angry ones would be easily origin for tribal name e.g. Lutici are Polabian Slav tribe http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lutici, but it is not really as close to 'guti')
alternative would be ljudi (people) which is to my ear much more alike to Gothic Thiuda than Germanic Deutch is...
according to disputed medieval source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronicle_of_the_Priest_of_Duklja) south Slavs are Goths...
but Scordisci are Celtic people... Serdi are Celtic people from area of Scordisci who became Thracians..
Serdi may be explanation for I2a-din on west coast of Asia minor that was never settled by Slavs...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serdi
ancient Rome historians did speculate that name Germans was used to identify original Celts...
but could original Celts have been Cimmerians as claimed by Josephus? Celts called themselves Keltoi, which could be a version of Guti...could be same tribal name as Guti and even same as Anatolian Hatti (whose primary god has name Taru similar to Germanic Thor, while later Hittite have same god as Tarhun, which is alike to slavic Perun, celtic taranis, and Baltic Perkunas..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teshub
note that Celts are mentioned also as living in Africa, and there is no native European R1b in Africa, but there is native I2a1...
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper...99.01.0239:book=1:chapter=3&highlight=galatia138 Few nations have wandered so far and wide as the Galatæ. We meet with them in Europe, Asia, and Africa, under the various names of Galatæ Galatians, Gauls, and Kelts. Galatia, in Asia Minor, was settled by one of these hordes.
this also shows Galatae gives names Kelts and Gauls..why not both Galatae and Goti being names derived from older Guti?
Celts in Africa are in my opinion I2a1 and went under name Garamantes
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garamantes
Garamantes were advanced civilization that had irrigation systems that made Sahara bloom...their capital Germa (name to the town seems to have been given by archeologist recently to mark capital of Garamantes) is near modern town Sebha...
alternative name for Celts is Gali... this is area of Galicia in east Europe
that is core of I2a2 in Ukraine area...
and that is also the area of white-Croatia, while white-Serbia is west of it in land Boika, which is, as explained above, Bohemia where another hotspot of I2a2 is.......
so Slavic I2a-Din we may map to white-Croats, white-Serbs and perhaps Goths...
white in white-Croats and white-Serbs was translated to white = west (ancient color system) ...
was white-Syrians the same? or was white-Serbs and white-Croats remain of old white-Syrian/white-Sart
Bavarian manuscript speaks of state of Zeruiani was so big (and above we could see how big is state of Serians) that all Slavs come form it.....
big state of Zeruiani - is it about syrians or white Syrians? if it was white-Syrians this may have been about state of Goths or Sarmatians (though Seneca is clear that in Caspian highlands Serians live among Sarmatians which implies not being one of them) ... if it is about Syrians, than this could be about hellenic empire....
Zorya = Slavic triple goddess - representing 3 stars: morning, evening and night..
her name means "dawn" and morning star is maped to northern star Zvezda(star) Danica... (dan = day)... if we would try to map zeruiani to Hellenic people, tribal name derived from zorya (as in Zeruiani) would by name of her most important morning star form map to Danaans (acheans - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danaans) well...
so Syrians might have been I think J2 with e-V13 and white-Syrians I2a
this is consistent with haplogroup I not really widely present in Sumer only north of it among Kurds..
curiously, Siraces who lived on north shores of Black sea and are thought to be same or related to Serboi, are most hellenized of all Sarmatians..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siraces
Zorya lives together with sun, east, north and west wind...sun is symbol of ancient Macedonians...in Greek mythology winds are Anemoi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anemoi , same gods are Venti in latin) and I map them to Slavic tribes: west wind Zephyrus (born in caves of thrace_ to Serbs, east wind Eurus to Russians, north wind Borea to Prussians/Borussians, and son of Zephyrus is Carpus whom I map to Croats).. so Zorya/Danica/Danaans living together with sun (ancient Macedonians) and north, west and east wind ( = Veneti/Thracian proto-Slavs) would be about Helenic empire... in fact, those Veneti/Venti tribes might have been not really Slavic originally but something in between germanic, celtic and slavic speaking, while R1a spoke Balto-Slavic.....maybe they were east germanic tribes that are also west slavic...perhaps Scirri, Hiri that are known to have been related to Venedi...
are Kurdish Sorani related to Serians or white Serians?
I think Serians as they have more J2 and less I2a than northern Kurds who would be related to white Serians / Cimmerians same as Serbs...thus Sorani would be more like Danaans/Acheans...
so north Kurds would be closer to Serbs, south Kurds to Greeks...
and of course there is some Scythian / (proto-slavic?) R1a in both...
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