European Races

Which racial classification do you belong to?

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Goga said:
I don't agree with you. Genetically and phenotypically Greeks are closer to the Germans and Scandinavians than Iberians are.
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And don't try to deviate attention changing the speech, since what you say at the begining and has been totally refuted it's perfectly clear.
 
No there're many instruments to measure the phenotypes.

Some guys are using the autosomal DNA, because they think that they're better off with that. They're only cheating themselves and morons.

But who says that the autosomal DNA is the BEST instrument to measure the distance between phenotypes. Show me just 1 renowned and celebrated scholar that clams that DOCECAD is the best instrument too visualize the phenotypes???
 
Knovas said:
And don't try to deviate attention changing the speech, since what you say at the begining and has been totally refuted it's perfectly clear.
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The only link between Spaniards and Germanic/Scandinavian tribes is the Celtic link, R1b. Germanic people have MUCH more Celtic DNA (Medit.), than Spaniards Germanic DNA (Nordic). R1b connects somehow both populations.

The greatest proportion of R1b in the Iberians is NOT Nordic, but Medit.!
 
Man, I already quoted you saying that Greeks are closer GENETICALLY speaking too. What are you trying to argue since none of the genetics plots and none admixture analysis place Greeks where you say? They aren't closer, get real.
 
Goga said:
The thing is that the Greek phenotype is classified as Alpine one. And Alpines are in general between Nordics and Meds!

As far as I know in general Greeks are bigger in statue than the Iberians. Iberians are smaller and more fragile. There's a reason why Nordic phenotype borders the Alpine one and NOT the Mediterranean. There's a gradual formation of the phenotypes!

UK is a special case because British folks are an admixture of the Mediterranean and Nordic phenotype! Many Brits are 'Celtic immigrants' from south Europe!
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Actually the closest to nordids are Atlantids, which most Iberians belong to.

Goga said:
I don't agree with you! No way, autosomal DNA says nothing about your skin-colour or anything about your phenotype. Phenotypes are only visible and measurable.

I know that your sense organs can lie, but measurable proportion of somebody's crania and skeleton are facts.
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Are you a comedian ? Actually Autosomal-DNA includes all the genes that determine pigmentation and phenotype.


Goga said:
As far as I know is Iberian R1b NOT Nordic. I think that R1b in Greeks is more Nordic, from Northern Europe (Germanic peoples) than the Iberian one. Plus Greeks have much more R1a and I (which I do consider as Central-East European).
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Haplogroups are not related with phenotype. Iran ha 50% of R1a, also India has plenty of R1a too.

Goga said:
I don't agree with you. Genetically and phenotypically Greeks are closer to the Germans and Scandinavians than Iberians are.
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Completely wrong. Iberians are FAR closer to germans/scandinavians than greeks are.

Iberians are only closer to other Celts in West Atlantic Europe. Greeks do have much more Nordic Scandinavian and Slavic DNA than the Iberians do.
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More slavic, but not more nordic. At Eurogenes Spain shows 22% North-European while Greeks 4%

In general I do consider the Greeks much more 'Nordic' than the Iberians.
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Genetics say otherwise. Iberia has by far, much more nordic autosomal than Greece.
 
Table of genetic distances. Spain is far closer to Sweden than Greece is :
Spain--Sweden 0.055 , Greece--Sweden 0.084

fsttiant.jpg


Study :
[FONT=&quot]http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2730349/table/t1-09_94_tian/


Another one. Spain--Norway 0.085 , Greece-Norway 0.103

tehvalu.jpg




Eurogenes North-Euroepan admixture :

scaled.php

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Goga said:
Man, it has nothing to do with having less or more Anatolian/Mideast, African, East Asian etc. influences. Why don't you understand that!
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What are you talking about? Seems like you know very little about how DNA works.
 
Goga said:
The only link between Spaniards and Germanic/Scandinavian tribes is the Celtic link, R1b. Germanic people have MUCH more Celtic DNA (Medit.), than Spaniards Germanic DNA (Nordic). R1b connects somehow both populations.

The greatest proportion of R1b in the Iberians is NOT Nordic, but Medit.!
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Iberians are actually less than 50% Med / Southern Euro in autosomal DNA testing. About 40-45% compared to 55-60% Western, Northern / North Atlanitc and Eastern Euro.
 
Sure, I'm not blind. If you take a DODECAD admixture it's clearly says that Iberians are closer to let say Scandinavians than the Greeks are. But which scholar says that nowadays DODECAD is the best indicator to display how close the phenotypes to each other are? It's all in premature phase, much more research must be done!

Maybe is Greek E much closer to Scandinavian R1b, than Iberian R1b to Scandinavian R1b. DODECAD admixture analysis don't show that!

The thing is that Greeks have much more North European DNA than the Spaniards do have. R1b, I, R1a from North Eruope.

As far as I know Greek phenotype is closer to the Nordic phenotype than Iberian phehotype to the Nordic one. And I'll not change my mind. I'm done, BASTA!

But I don't have anything against you. You can call yourselves whatever you want. Super Atlantic-Nordic-pure-max-100%-full, I don't care.

BTW, In India live MANY phenotypes, some of these phenotypes are very 'big'.
 
Goga said:
Sure, I'm not blind. If you take a DODECAD admixture it's clearly says that Iberians are closer to let say Scandinavians than the Greeks are. But which scholars says that nowadays DODECAD is the best indicator to display how close the phenotypes to each other are. It's all in premature phase, much more research must be done!
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Oh come on ! It's from scientific studies, the study of Tian et al. here is the link :

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2730349/?tool=pmcentrez

The thing is that Greeks have much more North European DNA than the Spaniards do have.
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Prove it.

BTW, In India live MANY phenotypes, some of these phenotypes are very 'big'.
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Pakistan, Iran, Indian have very high levels of R1a
 
spongetaro said:
I don't know how they made that map and how large were the samples but it is just impossible that Belgium has less North European component than France
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Not impossible at all. However, one also needs to consider Belgium's North Atlantic component (21%).
 
Goga said:
Sure, I'm not blind. If you take a DODECAD admixture it's clearly says that Iberians are closer to let say Scandinavians than the Greeks are. But which scholar says that nowadays DODECAD is the best indicator to display how close the phenotypes to each other are? It's all in premature phase, much more research must be done!

Maybe is Greek E much closer to Scandinavian R1b, than Iberian R1b to Scandinavian R1b. DODECAD admixture analysis don't show that!

The thing is that Greeks have much more North European DNA than the Spaniards do have. R1b, I, R1a from North Eruope.

As far as I know Greek phenotype is closer to the Nordic phenotype than Iberian phehotype to the Nordic one. And I'll not change my mind. I'm done, BASTA!

But I don't have anything against you. You can call yourselves whatever you want. Super Atlantic-Nordic-pure-max-100%-full, I don't care.

BTW, In India live MANY phenotypes, some of these phenotypes are very 'big'.
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All the peer reviewed studies say pretty much the same thing as Dodecad and Eurogenes. You are WAY off on this one. You may be done but you are embarrassingly WRONG!
 
spongetaro said:
And how do you explain German's Northern European admixture (only 29%)?
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They also have a high Balto-Slavic score which is closely related to the Northern European category.

p.s. sorry, Wilhem beat me to it.:ashamed2:
 
Germany is 21% North Atlantic. I'm not certain about Balto-Slavic.
 
spongetaro said:
Do you have the map for the other admixture (Balto-slavic, North Atlantic...)?
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The Balto-Slavic map Wilhelm posted also provides an answer for you on Belgium.
 
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