How can IE migration be explained without mentioning Seima Turbino?

v2-cb885a7296c3277ee3d39e1618338386_1440w.webp


Above: This is a person in a mussel shell (two mussel shells on the back, stepping on a turtle under his feet), Sanxingdui jade, source: "Samsung Exploring Jade" (Xiamen Dianshizhai Art Museum, Xiamen Ancient Culture and Art Museum)

vs

Early fourth-century BC Attic pottery vessel in the shape of Aphrodite inside a shell from the Phanagoria cemetery in the Taman Peninsula
Atuell_en_forma_d%27Afrodita_en_una_petxina%2C_%C3%80tica%2C_necr%C3%B2polis_de_Fanagoria%2C_pin%C3%ADnsula_de_Taman._Primer_quart_del_segle_IV_aC%2C_cer%C3%A0mica.JPG


Sandro_Botticelli_-_La_nascita_di_Venere_-_Google_Art_Project_-_edited.jpg


The Birth of Venus, by Sandro Botticelli c. 1485–1486.
 
Helios-chariot-relief-sculpture-Troy-National-Museums-1872.jpg

1368014404-3279701348_wn.jpg

v2-86be33e6355cab5e4b613b23fe6df26a_1440w.webp








HELIOS, GOD OF THE SUN​

 
Sarmatian spirals:

Wooden single-plane figures of a deer, bound with gold plates. Gold, silver, wood. Mound No. 1.

Wooden single-plane figures of a deer, bound with gold plates. Gold, silver, wood. Mound No. 1.

The rim of a vessel depicts a rider on a horse. Gold. Mound No. 1. UFITs RAS.

The rim of a vessel depicts a rider on a horse. Gold. Mound No. 1. UFITs RAS.


Okunevo spiral patterns on deers:
Museum_in_Abakan%2C_Khakassia%2C_Russia_2021_-_petroglyphs.jpg


Sanxingdui spirals at china bronze:
b96bf57137b1461e93457e33895d4070.jpg
 
"The Pir Panjal is a mountain range situated in the western part of the Lesser Himalayas extending from the east-southeast to west-northwest across the border of Himachal Pradesh and Jammu and Kashmir. The sights are awesome: lofty peaks rising to the heights of up to 4,000 meters above the sea level, swift-flowing streams and deep-set valleys overgrown with cedars and scattered tiny houses surrounded by little fields.
In June 2017, this was the site of a Russian-Indian archaeological expedition launched to find and describe stone horses, enigmatic statues lost in remote mountain areas"

c4863b2e9f38dc1f0c75ccb110295f67.jpg

0.jpg

659e-knipfsf6044215.jpg


A bronze human head unearthed from Sanxingdui. (From the official website of Sanxingdui Museum)

 
Sarmatian spirals:

Wooden single-plane figures of a deer, bound with gold plates. Gold, silver, wood. Mound No. 1.

Wooden single-plane figures of a deer, bound with gold plates. Gold, silver, wood. Mound No. 1.

The rim of a vessel depicts a rider on a horse. Gold. Mound No. 1. UFITs RAS.

The rim of a vessel depicts a rider on a horse. Gold. Mound No. 1. UFITs RAS.


Okunevo spiral patterns on deers:
Museum_in_Abakan%2C_Khakassia%2C_Russia_2021_-_petroglyphs.jpg


Sanxingdui spirals at china bronze:
b96bf57137b1461e93457e33895d4070.jpg

Miletus, Sub-Mycenaean pottery
Miletus, Sub-Mycenaean pottery

DescriptionMiletus, Sub-Mycenaean pottery

snake worship at middle east:
Snake_decoration_on_pot_from_Rumeilah%2C_Al_Ain.jpg

Snake motif on Bronze Age pottery from Rumailah, Al Ain.

1,300bc - 700bc
image_5c485c66107d41.28051022.jpg

11_big.jpg

saruq-alhadid-booklet-english-2022
PDF (www.dm.gov.ae)

vs

urn:cambridge.org:id:binary:20180104010448536-0636:S0003598X16002349:S0003598X16002349_fig6g.gif


"Drawing of three bronze ornaments: a) Karasuk culture c. 1400–1200 BC, diameter around 100mm Abakan Museum; b) Shimao 2000–1800 BC, diameter around 120mm, private museum in Shenmu; c) excavated at Taosi, diameter around 125mm Shanxi province (drawing by John Rawson)."

https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/antiquity/article/shimao-and-erlitou-new-perspectives-on-the-origins-of-the-bronze-industry-in-central-china/672573C3699701D312E7D2286B973D5F


white-joyce-metallurgy-bangles.jpg

"In northern northeast Thailand, bracelets like these were by far the most popular metal object, and almost all of them were made of a tin-bronze alloy. A few hundred kilometers south to another prehistoric site, bangles weren’t all that prominent. (Image: The Ban Chiang Project)"
https://penntoday.upenn.edu/news/Pe...acts-Thailand-challenge-archaeological-theory

la tene culture:
29389705-b0fe-47f2-b0ea-71c5ea62c13d.jpg


number 20 in okunevo culture:
kulturyi-ranney-bronzyi-yuzhnoy-sibiri.jpg


https://arheologija.ru/hlobyistina-proishozhdenie-i-razvitie-kulturyi-ranney-bronzyi-yuzhnoy-sibiri/
 
1,300bc - 700bc
image_5c485c66107d41.28051022.jpg

11_big.jpg

saruq-alhadid-booklet-english-2022
PDF (www.dm.gov.ae)

vs

urn:cambridge.org:id:binary:20180104010448536-0636:S0003598X16002349:S0003598X16002349_fig6g.gif


"Drawing of three bronze ornaments: a) Karasuk culture c. 1400–1200 BC, diameter around 100mm Abakan Museum; b) Shimao 2000–1800 BC, diameter around 120mm, private museum in Shenmu; c) excavated at Taosi, diameter around 125mm Shanxi province (drawing by John Rawson)."
https://www.cambridge.org/core/jour...entral-china/672573C3699701D312E7D2286B973D5F

white-joyce-metallurgy-bangles.jpg

"In northern northeast Thailand, bracelets like these were by far the most popular metal object, and almost all of them were made of a tin-bronze alloy. A few hundred kilometers south to another prehistoric site, bangles weren’t all that prominent. (Image: The Ban Chiang Project)"
https://penntoday.upenn.edu/news/Pe...acts-Thailand-challenge-archaeological-theory

la tene culture:
29389705-b0fe-47f2-b0ea-71c5ea62c13d.jpg


number 20 in okunevo culture:
kulturyi-ranney-bronzyi-yuzhnoy-sibiri.jpg


https://arheologija.ru/hlobyistina-proishozhdenie-i-razvitie-kulturyi-ranney-bronzyi-yuzhnoy-sibiri/

celtic:
69204q00.jpg


Iran ca. 9th century BCE:
main-image


Azerbaijan
heritage-06-00010-i012.png

 
shimao shaft tomb:
657bc2cc498ed2d78b107664.jpeg


"The 15 pit tombs can be divided into two areas, north and south, of which the southern area has a higher level of tombs, with rounded corners and rectangular planes, and the tomb area is generally more than 10 square meters, with a depth of 3.5 meters to 4 meters."
Mycenaean shaft tomb:
lak_gr2.gif

images

------


- mogou shaft and side chamber grave at Qijia (seima turbino culture) at china:
urn:cambridge.org:id:binary:20221130151029009-0747:S0003598X22001570:S0003598X22001570_fig4.png
urn:cambridge.org:id:binary:20231117111102554-0468:S0003598X22001570:S0003598X22001570_fig4.png


- catacomb culture shaft and side chamber grave:
1-s2.0-S2352409X21001061-gr2.jpg


- ancient mexican tombs:
Depiction-of-the-range-of-shaft-tomb-forms-found-within-the-Atemajac-valley-Modified.png

The location of ANE admixture steppe-people to meet Caucasus people. EHG or WHSG or the other ANE-admixture people had different languages?

1. genetics :

"We thus propose the following hypothesis: that CLV cline people migrated southwards ca. 4400BCE, or about a millennium before the appearance of the Yamnaya, (admixing with different substratum populations along the way) and then westwards before finally reaching Central Anatolia."

"...points to the North Caucasus-Lower Volga area as the homeland of Indo-Anatolian languages and to the Serednii Stih archaeological culture of the Dnipro-Don area as the homeland of Indo-European languages."

[Image: 2024-05-25-8-20-58.jpg]


2. Alexander Kozintsev belief. Archaeologically Ural east people had contacted Caspian S-E from Meso to Eneolitic. Now he changed the location to altai.

Ural.jpg


3. according to Kortlandt

"If we can identify Indo-Hittite and Indo-European with the beginning and the end of the Sredny Stog culture, respectively, it will be clear that the linguistic evidence from our family does not lead us beyond Gimbutas’ secondary homeland and that the Khvalynsk culture on the middle Volga and the Maykop culture in the northern Caucasus cannot be identified with the Indo-Europeans. Any proposal which goes beyond the Sredny Stog culture must start from the possible affinities of Indo-European with other language families. It is usually recognized that the best candidate in this respect is the Uralic language family, while further connections with the Altaic languages and perhaps even Dravidian are possible. The hypothesis that Indo-European is genetically related to a Caucasian language family or to Afro-Asiatic seems much less probable to me. What we do have to take into account is the typological similarity of Proto-Indo-European to the North-West Caucasian languages. If this similarity can be attributed to areal factors, we may think of Indo-European as a branch of Uralo-Altaic which was transformed under the influence of a Caucasian substratum. It now appears that this view is actually supported by the archaeological evidence. If it is correct, we may locate the earliest ancestors of the speakers of Proto-Indo-European north of the Caspian Sea in the seventh millennium (cf. Mallory 1989: 192f.). This is essentially in agreement with Gimbutas’ theory. [Cf. now Kortlandt 1989.]"
 
Pazyryk culture :
Griffon, ornament of horse harness. Tumulus 1, Ak-Alakha-1 burial site


Griffon, ornament of horse harness. Tumulus 1, Ak-Alakha-1 burial site


The big felt carpet (GE # 1687-95). Fifth Pazyryk Tumulus. On left is a fragment with a goddess. On the right is a fragment with a horseman. State Hermitage, St. Petersburg

The big felt carpet (GE # 1687-95). Fifth Pazyryk Tumulus. On left is a fragment with a goddess. On the right is a fragment with a horseman. State Hermitage, St. Petersburg

Sanxingdui :
ABUIABACGAAgzcLingYo97aU_wUw7gU46Ac.jpg

Sanxingdui_Oct_2007_593.jpg

Ⅰ号大型青铜神树.jpg
 
Pazyryk culture:
1-pazyryk-petuxi


vs

sanxingdui
28-2103221H355.jpg

 
Hittite sun disk:
Bronze standards collection

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sanxingdui turtle back(?)

 A turtle-back grid taken at the No. 7 Sacrificial Pit.
"A turtle-back grid taken at the No. 7 "Sacrificial Pit"."
 
No,haplogroup R1b2 tocharians just produced some sex slaves for Chinese brothals in Tang dynasty,conquered nothing,sanxingdui had none of your R,in fact,no R with TMRCA surpass 1000 years muslims era
 
川滇没有单倍群R有超过1000年的TMRCA,没有样本,甚至没有N1a1真正的serma turbino,他们有N1b2,至于云南就更可怕了,只有一个M117-CTS5308分支,没有别的,一些D,F2,K2a本地人,不多,别再玩实况游戏和发布不相关的东西了,你没那么强大。
 
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Ancient DNA from Gaoshan City, Majiayao and Yangshao have all been published, and Sanxingdui and central plain Shijiahe have a common artistic style. Do ancient Egypt and European R have a common artistic style? I don’t think so. I have a hunch that the Pharaoh’s R is also a forgery, and all the R1b samples in ancient Egypt were probably fake
 
赫梯太阳盘:
青铜标准收藏

对比

三星堆龟背(?)

七号祭祀坑拍摄的龟背栅。
“七号‘祭祀坑’处拍摄的龟背网格。”
Turtle shell,haha,need not to go to turkey to find clue,There are sanxingdui idol at lingjiatan culture,and idols of sanxingdui in lingjiatan culture,turtle shell tool goes back as early to Jiahu culture
1716747386704.png
1716747414853.png
 
- "The World Turtle in Hindu mythology is known as Akūpāra (Sanskrit: अकूपार), or sometimes Chukwa. An example of a reference to the World Turtle in Hindu literature is found in Jñānarāja (the author of Siddhantasundara, writing c. 1500): "A vulture, whichever has only little strength, rests in the sky holding a snake in its beak for a prahara [three hours]. Why can [the deity] in the form of a tortoise, who possesses an inconceivable potency, not hold the Earth in the sky for a kalpa [billions of years]?"[1] The British philosopher John Locke made reference to this in his 1689 tract, An Essay Concerning Human Understanding, which compares one who would say that properties inhere in "substance" to the Indian, who said the world was on an elephant, which was on a tortoise, "but being again pressed to know what gave support to the broad-backed tortoise, replied—something, he knew not what".[2]

PSM_V10_D562_The_hindoo_earth.jpg


- "Illustration of a Classic Veracruz stone altar relief at El Tajín. As part of the scene of rulers coming to power; in the lower centre is a throne under which stands a turtle as symbol of the earth."

ans_201_04_2.jpg

ans_201_01_2.jpg


- The Sanskrit word 'Kurma' (Devanagari: कूर्म) means 'Tortoise' and 'Turtle' :

Kurma_Avatar_by_Raja_Ravi_Varma.jpg


- sanxingdui:

v2-cb885a7296c3277ee3d39e1618338386_1440w.webp

Above: This is a person in a mussel shell (two mussel shells on the back, stepping on a turtle under his feet), Sanxingdui jade, source: "Samsung Exploring Jade" (Xiamen Dianshizhai Art Museum, Xiamen Ancient Culture and Art Museum)

1368014404-3279701348_wn.jpg
 
Sarmatian spirals:

Wooden single-plane figures of a deer, bound with gold plates. Gold, silver, wood. Mound No. 1.

Wooden single-plane figures of a deer, bound with gold plates. Gold, silver, wood. Mound No. 1.

The rim of a vessel depicts a rider on a horse. Gold. Mound No. 1. UFITs RAS.

The rim of a vessel depicts a rider on a horse. Gold. Mound No. 1. UFITs RAS.

seima turbino (one spiral, two spirals, three spiral combination):
05-02.jpg


Okunevo spiral patterns on deers:
Museum_in_Abakan%2C_Khakassia%2C_Russia_2021_-_petroglyphs.jpg


Sanxingdui spirals at china bronze:
b96bf57137b1461e93457e33895d4070.jpg

where did Darius originate in ?

Darius_detail_on_the_Darius_vase.jpg
 

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