slavic, germanic and others for the fun

[MOESAN]

Slavs call themselves Slovane (approximation for all slavic), meaning all people who understand Slavic language. It also sounds close to word "slava" fame, but I think it is purely coincidental.

In contrast Germanic people was called with an exonym "Nemci", meaning people who don't speak (a slavic language).

Slavs have also an exonym for Romance language speakers, "Vlosi". What could this mean in slavic languages? The closest sounding word is Vlos (hair). Does Vlasi mean hairy people? Does it make sense?


I'm sort of guessing that Vlasi an exonym because this name is popular through slavic languages. However local romance speakers of balkans called themselves Vlahi, Valah, there is also region of Valahia in Romania. Therefore Vlasi might be slavisized Vlah.

in the most of forms, it is an A and not an O which appears:: slAv-: I don't exclude any explanation: I-E *Kl-w greek cleos < > celtic cluintinn, clywed, klewed "to hear", klod (clot) "glory", "fame", "reputation" germanic *hl-û-d "noise" >> english loud - german laut "sound"- dutch luid "noisy" - *Hlûd-wîk: HLODOVECUS >> C(H)LOVIS + LUDWIG / LUDVIK / LODOWIJK / LUDOVIC / LOUIS / LEWIS... the meaning link of "glory", "reputation", "fame" with "sound", "noise", "shout" , is well attested in languages: breton brud << french brut/bruit "noise" = " rumour" + "good fame" (brudet: "famous") - for me, a name as "the famous ones" is not too amazing among old I-Ean tribes...
by the way, the word slovo = "word", "speech" could very well be linked too toe this meaning of "noise" << "speech" >> "fame" - no real obstacle - the variation of vowels associated to a same consonnants group seems common in ancient I-Ean to create close but different significations -
I'll answer you about vlosi/vlasi/vlak/vla(k)h: thi)ese terms are linked too in my mind

 

[MOESAN]

this *K-l >> *kel- /*kle- root seems having a huge posterity in daughters languages of I-E origin, associated with "shout"; "noise", "glory" (Latin << **klor-i ???):
not stupid at all because latine knew a lot of evolutions K- >> G- without any explanation at this date, if not a dead ancient dialect based on a pre-I-E sunstratum)
we can find: sanskrit usà-kalah "rooster", "cock" calling down - Greek kaleô "to call" "to hail" >> ekklêsia "meeting by calling"/"convocation" >> Lat- ecclesia >> église, iglesia, gleisa, chiesa "church" - Lat calare "to call" >> calendae - intercalare/intercaler + >> clamor >> clameur, chiamare / llamar Engl- "claim"- Germ- hellan >> to "hail" > "hello" - plus with a meaning shift "clear sound" to light colour Lat clarus >> clair, chiaro, claro, clar, clarté + clairon Germ- hell, Helle "light" >> hallen "to resound" "to reverberate" >> *s-k-l schallen "to ring' 'to sound" classis ("class"): "call/convocation of troops etc... a.s.o...

concerning Vlak/Vla(k)h - Slav- could propose the alternances vlaši / vlakhi:vlahi or vlasi / vlaki - if Slavs say Vlasi so the origin was vlaki for them
romance speakers could have had vlahi/valah based on a germanic pronounciation *wal(a)h - vlosi is a possible alternative to vlasi -

##vlos or vles "hair" seems coming from a *w-l we find in vela, voile "sail", "veil", velu "strongly haired", velours, maybe wool /wolle - olan / folan / gwlan "wool" -
-

 

[LeBrok]

concerning Vlak/Vla(k)h - Slav- could propose the alternances vlaši / vlakhi:vlahi or vlasi / vlaki - if Slavs say Vlasi so the origin was vlaki for them
romance speakers could have had vlahi/valah based on a germanic pronounciation *wal(a)h - vlosi is a possible alternative to vlasi -

##vlos or vles "hair" seems coming from a *w-l we find in vela, voile "sail", "veil", velu "strongly haired", velours, maybe wool /wolle - olan / folan / gwlan "wool" -
-

Interesting, perhaps the word describes celtic/Italic people of Valahia dressed in tartans, wool clothing, or even sheep skins?

 

[MOESAN]

Interesting, perhaps the word describes celtic/Italic people of Valahia dressed in tartans, wool clothing, or even sheep skins?

not stupid (we have some surprises when we look at namings and semantic evolutions) - but at this stage of MY knowledge I prefer considering the name of these foreign people (foreign for the others who named them) as derivated from the Volcae celtic tribe... it is, I think, the "official current" scholar view?

 

[MOESAN]

this *K-l >> *kel- /*kle- root seems having a huge posterity in daughters languages of I-E origin, associated with "shout"; "noise", "glory" (Latin << **klor-i ???):
not stupid at all because latine knew a lot of evolutions K- >> G- without any explanation at this date, if not a dead ancient dialect based on a pre-I-E sunstratum)
we can find: sanskrit usà-kalah "rooster", "cock" calling down - Greek kaleô "to call" "to hail" >> ekklêsia "meeting by calling"/"convocation" >> Lat- ecclesia >> église, iglesia, gleisa, chiesa "church" - Lat calare "to call" >> calendae - intercalare/intercaler + >> clamor >> clameur, chiamare / llamar Engl- "claim"- Germ- hellan >> to "hail" > "hello" - plus with a meaning shift "clear sound" to light colour Lat clarus >> clair, chiaro, claro, clar, clarté + clairon Germ- hell, Helle "light" >> hallen "to resound" "to reverberate" >> *s-k-l schallen "to ring' 'to sound" classis ("class"): "call/convocation of troops etc... a.s.o...

concerning Vlak/Vla(k)h - Slav- could propose the alternances vlaši / vlakhi:vlahi or vlasi / vlaki - if Slavs say Vlasi so the origin was vlaki for them
romance speakers could have had vlahi/valah based on a germanic pronounciation *wal(a)h - vlosi is a possible alternative to vlasi -

##vlos or vles "hair" seems coming from a *w-l we find in vela, voile "sail", "veil", velu "strongly haired", velours, maybe wool /wolle - olan / folan / gwlan "wool" -
-

I answer myself here: no big danger, except an access of Altzheimer lost of memory - and I remarked I was full of sympathy for myself -
here some addenda if it could show the richess of I-Ean words not visible at first sight

I was persuaded I had finished concerning the I-Ean root *K-l-(w) linked to the meanings of «noise», «sound», «shout», «hearing» and «fame», «glory» but I found some more akin words:

in Slavic languages I put slava and slovo (sensible bet) -

looking at verbs I found too: slù[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]š[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]at' / s[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ł[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ysze[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ć /[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] slu[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]šati / [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]čuja[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif] / slušati [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]= «to hear», the meaning «to listen is rended by the same words, only polish and czech giving: [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]s[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]łuchać / shližeti [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif](this last one, spite some ressemblance, could be a «son» of a supposed [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]*s-glig- [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]«sharp noise», «metallic sound» [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]<???> [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]see Germ- [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]*kling- [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif](«[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]clang[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]», german [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]klang/klingen [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]by loan >>[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]french [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]clinquant, quincaille (clinquaille), clenche, déclencher, [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]english «[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]clink[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]») - just a bet!!![/FONT]

in Germanic languages I put words like: loud / laut / luid + icelandic hlj[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]óð[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]= «noise», «voice» -[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]I can add: to listen / [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]zuhören [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]/ [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]luisteren / lytte / lytte / lyssna + [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]icelandic [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]hlusta [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]= «to listen» ... ([/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]hl[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]ýð[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]inn [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]= «obediant» («who listen»!) - the problem is that except in icelandic for all words and in danish only for [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]hv- (*khw-) [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]the modern germanic languages show no spelling remnant of the old I-Ean [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]*K- [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]before liquid consonnants - [/FONT]

 

[Vedun]

Here are few. I have them on my Computer. I've noticed other words when I was reading few texts - i did not write them all down...

Those are only words in Swedish & Slovene (Svenska & Slovenska; that's why I've started to speculate about the Vens ("Veneti"), I have not touched other Slavic languages (yet).

brsk – brž, besok – obisk, bunke – bunka, nabunkati, butt – butniti, butati, drag – dražiti, dromme("dreme") – dremati, dronne – drneti, drysse – trositi, gnata – gnati, gnida – gnida, grabba – grabiti, grunda – gruntati, gunga – gugati, hel – cel, hit – hitro, kopa("koope") – kupiti, lank (" Lenk") – členk, mange – mnogi, mare – mora, mena – meniti, minne – spominjati se, mole – mujati se, mork – mrk, mračen, pigg – pik, pikati, rafsa – ravsati se, rappa – nadrapati, nabiti koga, sael – vesel, sen – pozen, skada – škoda, spoke – spaka, strašiti, stro – stresati, strype( "Strupe") – strup, tanja ut – stranjšati, tiga – tiše, tiho, tiske – tiše, šepetati, torg – trg, tycka("toohe") – tuhtati, udd – ud / okončina, vadra("vedre") – vedriti, vard – vreden, varg – volk, vingaard("vingord"(!)) – vinograd, hraki – hrakelj(izpljunek ob hrakanju), prast – prost, korug("kruh") – kruh, mylnar – mlinar, mylna – mlin, drag – dračje, gass("gos") – gos, kvas – kvas,kvašeno, raka – rak, jordgubbe – jagoda, redding – redič, kvar – kvar, bra – dobra, tarna("trna") – srna, dropp – droptina, strack("strok") – strok, mjod – med, ata,ete – jesti, kupa("keepe") – kipeti, most – mošt, olje – olje, satt – sit, soppa – župa, skorpa – skorja, skum – skominati(cediti sline), slubre – srebati, slen("slin") – slina, tjock("čok") – čok, torr – trd,trdo, dyrka – dirka, hlaupa – hlapec, sula – sulica, radd("rt") – rit, otta("oča") – oče, dykke – dekle, frakka – frača, loka – lok, pridn – priden, val – voliti.

There are of course many more...
"noc und tag" (noč in dan)
"dalen" (dolina; "dol"
"RÄKA = slov. RAK(EC)"
läkare - lekarna (lek; "lečiti" (zdraviti: healer)
etc

 

[FrankN]

Here are few. I have them on my Computer. I've noticed other words when I was reading few texts - i did not write them all down...

Those are only words in Swedish & Slovene (Svenska & Slovenska; that's why I've started to speculate about the Vens ("Veneti"), I have not touched other Slavic languages (yet).

brsk – brž, besok – obisk, bunke – bunka, nabunkati, butt – butniti, butati, drag – dražiti, dromme("dreme") – dremati, dronne – drneti, drysse – trositi, gnata – gnati, gnida – gnida, grabba – grabiti, grunda – gruntati, gunga – gugati, hel – cel, hit – hitro, kopa("koope") – kupiti, lank (" Lenk") – členk, mange – mnogi, mare – mora, mena – meniti, minne – spominjati se, mole – mujati se, mork – mrk, mračen, pigg – pik, pikati, rafsa – ravsati se, rappa – nadrapati, nabiti koga, sael – vesel, sen – pozen, skada – škoda, spoke – spaka, strašiti, stro – stresati, strype( "Strupe") – strup, tanja ut – stranjšati, tiga – tiše, tiho, tiske – tiše, šepetati, torg – trg, tycka("toohe") – tuhtati, udd – ud / okončina, vadra("vedre") – vedriti, vard – vreden, varg – volk, vingaard("vingord"(!)) – vinograd, hraki – hrakelj(izpljunek ob hrakanju), prast – prost, korug("kruh") – kruh, mylnar – mlinar, mylna – mlin, drag – dračje, gass("gos") – gos, kvas – kvas,kvašeno, raka – rak, jordgubbe – jagoda, redding – redič, kvar – kvar, bra – dobra, tarna("trna") – srna, dropp – droptina, strack("strok") – strok, mjod – med, ata,ete – jesti, kupa("keepe") – kipeti, most – mošt, olje – olje, satt – sit, soppa – župa, skorpa – skorja, skum – skominati(cediti sline), slubre – srebati, slen("slin") – slina, tjock("čok") – čok, torr – trd,trdo, dyrka – dirka, hlaupa – hlapec, sula – sulica, radd("rt") – rit, otta("oča") – oče, dykke – dekle, frakka – frača, loka – lok, pridn – priden, val – voliti.

There are of course many more...
"noc und tag" (noč in dan)
"dalen" (dolina; "dol"
"RÄKA = slov. RAK(EC)"
läkare - lekarna (lek; "lečiti" (zdraviti: healer)
etc

Interesting list. "Night and day" was a joke, wasnt't it?
A simple test is to check whether the Swedish word is also somehow present in English. That would indicate a Germanic or IE root (unless, of course, you believe that Slavs also massively interacted with English, so they equally borrowed Slavic words). I actually intended to do that test, but I couldn't find many of your Swedish words in Swedish-German or Swedish-English dictionaries. If you could add the English translation to your list (and in the process possibly clean it up), it would be easier to discuss your statement.
Nevertheless, a few of your examples are obviously not Slavic, but Germanic/ IE: besök (German Besuch), bunka (German Bunze, Engl. pint), grunda (to ground), hel (whole), koope (German kaufen->English cheap), länk (link), mange (many), mare (nightmare), mena (to mean), minne (mind, Latin: mens), piggi (French: pique), skada (scathe, damage), spoke (spook), tanja ut (to extend, to tension), tycka (to think), värd (worth), vingaard (vineyard), prast (priest), gas (goose), dropp (drop), ata (to eat), kupa (keep n.), most (mesh, fruit juice), olje (oil, Latin root), satt (satiated, German: satt), soppa (soup), skorpa (crust, German Schorf->English scarf), slubre (to slurp), slem (slime), tjock (tight), torr (dry, Low German: dürr), dyrka (to adore, from Latin), sula (sole of a shoe), val (poll, German: Wahl), dalen (dale, valley).

Jordgubbe is an artificial word that was created in 1841 to distinguish the new, artificially bred large strawberry from the small forest strawberries. It is made up from "jord-" (earth) and the old local Swedish word "gubbe" meaning small, rounded clump. And mjöd (mead) was already drunk by Germanics before any antique historian ever mentioned Slavs.

I give you mörk (dark), sen (late), and raka (prawn, crab). Bra (brave) may have a Germanic root, but in the sense of "good" it looks like borrowed from Slavic.

Skum (shady) is a bit tricky. It also exists in German as "Schummer" (dawn) and "Schemen" (shadow, spectre), but especially the first form is relatively recent (18th century) and may be a Slavic borrowing. However, the words are all related to "to shimmer" (display diffuse light), and that root is undoubtedly Germanic. Possibly initially a Slavic borrowing from Germanic, variants of which were later borrowed back into Swedish and Low German. In that case, rather from Pomeranians than from Vikings.
Words that you have missed include gräns (border). It has been borrowed from Slavic "kraina", not only by Swedish, but also German, Danish and Dutch (the latter two probably via German). Gurka (cucumber) was borrowed from Slavs, who had borrowed it from Greeks, who had borrowed it from Persians. German borrowed it in the 16th century, Swedish probably around the same time, again no Vikings involved here. A few more joint German/Swedish borrowings: Peitsche/piska (whip), Quark/kwarg (cottage cheese), Steppe/ stäpp (steppe, from Russian)

That makes ten words - 290 to go. Keep on with your efforts...

Interesting is torg (marketplace). That's obviously not Slavic, but Venetic / Illyrian (Tergeste, Trogir etc.). How did that word make it to the Baltic Sea? The same applies to tiga (to be silent), which doesn't have German or English parallels, but is found in Latin (tacere).

 

[Vedun]

Torg simply includes the Lingual root TR (or DR). It means something which is constantly "rotating", "circulating" (an exchange(market); an ancesT(o)Ry (fusion of words "Anta" (in my dialect (Slovene Prekmurian) as Inda ("once upon a time"); "Anta-ent" (Ancient"+TR; AntseT(o)r; Ancestor) or "TROSITI" ("drysse"); "TORITI" was one of many forms; "to scatter (around)" (spreading)...And TRGanje - tear (apart)...like a TRos (spore); "throw"(away). Torek (Tuesday - a day after the 1st day; "Thor-ek" "little tor"; povTORit ("repeat") ПОВТОР, второй... it is the purest Slavic root. In my language we speak po-NAVljati ((after; "again") to repeat) instead of Russian povtorit (the Tuesday however remained the name "torek"), where is used word Lingual root Nav, as the Slavic term for Hell (Also check Dante's 9 circles of Hell) (you would probably understand this as Neblich or Nebel; "Nebo"; "himmel") or Astral (Shadowy) world, realm of the Shadows (ghosts)... Word Nav (9) have had sacred pre christian meaning of (inverted) DEVas (gods; "Deus"; Asuras (Osiris; the cult which arrived over the Vedic culture to Egypt and from Egypt as an offspring called Christianity into Byzantium as Osiris's Krst (Krishna; Kresnik; later "Krst-os"(Kristos; Kristus; "Christ"), the world which is constantly "repeating" itself in the cycle of Zodiac (Zoo; Jiv; Živ; "a-Live
9 (DEVyat девять; Devet (9); where NAV is the lower world of the 9 worlds of Gods (the land of god Kresnik (this was Slovene form for god "Perun") - a Ygdrasil (Yaga (also check "Baba Yaga" - this word remained in your lands as "Perchta") Tree(drevo)...That's why Thor's position as the "Second one" (cyclic; Torus) and after him came Christ (Krstos)...(Osiris - Asura which is hidden behind this name; "Aesir" ("god", "beam"; a-Surya (an opponent to Devas; "(not) sun" in Sanskrit; Osiris (lord of the underworld (Abrahamic (opponent to Brahmanism)...

 

[Vedun]

"Skum (shady)", no the word means "foam" in Swedish or better said it is equal to Slovene "skominati" (or cediti sline; "making your mouth (full) with "water"(salina), literally "sieving salina" (foam)(you can not "TR" (Trositi/Drysse) fluids, you can only stream them or "sieving" them). Sadly many older words almost disappeared from our language after pan-Serbian domination...

 

[FrankN]

"Skum (shady)", no the word means "foam" in Swedish or better said it is equal to Slovene "skominati" (or cediti sline; "making your mouth (full) with "water"(salina), literally "sieving salina" (foam)(you can not "TR" (Trositi/Drysse) fluids, you can only stream them or "sieving" them). Sadly many older words almost disappeared from our language after pan-Serbian domination...

Swedish has the word twice, as adjective "shady", and as noun "foam". The latter is found in all Germanic languages except for Modern English - Middle English "skum" didn't survive. Are you sure Slovene "skominati" isn't a Germanic borrowing - most Slavic languages appear to use pena/piena. Actually, one of the reasons I assumed the adjective "skum" to be a possible Slavic loan was the fact that it doesn't correspond in meaning to the noun.

 

[Vedun]

No, because there are other forms of this word. "Skomin"(SKM(N)) = poželenje / sla ("a lust"(LS-T - or inverted SL(many germanic roots use inverted slavic roots or vice versa; like also Russian RABOTA (and "ROBOT") in German "ARBEIT"; the Lingual root is RBT, which comes from the Slavic root RB or "Use" (to use something); "consumption, to spend; "ver-BRingen" which transmuted into "Ge-BRauch" (G)(BRCH or (G)BRH) inversion of RB)). This form Skum/Skomin/Skominjati is found only in Swedish and Slovene and in no other language that I have noticed so far. And shady transmuted from the lingual root SHD or SNT (with transmutation into "Ts" C; "Senca" like a SHAD-ow - where SEN or SANje or SAN (in Croatian) as a "dream"(dremati; this is "traumen" in your language) in Slovene comes from)...of course you will say that "dream" comes from Germanic. But this claim has no basis, like the claim that Tree or Mama or Mutter or Mleko(Milk) is also a Germanic in origin which is not and has much older origins, when there was no nation of germanic or slavic people yet...

 

[MOESAN]

Here are few. I have them on my Computer. I've noticed other words when I was reading few texts - i did not write them all down...

Those are only words in Swedish & Slovene (Svenska & Slovenska; that's why I've started to speculate about the Vens ("Veneti"), I have not touched other Slavic languages (yet).

brsk – brž, besok – obisk, bunke – bunka, nabunkati, butt – butniti, butati, drag – dražiti, dromme("dreme") – dremati, dronne – drneti, drysse – trositi, gnata – gnati, gnida – gnida, grabba – grabiti, grunda – gruntati, gunga – gugati, hel – cel, hit – hitro, kopa("koope") – kupiti, lank (" Lenk") – členk, mange – mnogi, mare – mora, mena – meniti, minne – spominjati se, mole – mujati se, mork – mrk, mračen, pigg – pik, pikati, rafsa – ravsati se, rappa – nadrapati, nabiti koga, sael – vesel, sen – pozen, skada – škoda, spoke – spaka, strašiti, stro – stresati, strype( "Strupe") – strup, tanja ut – stranjšati, tiga – tiše, tiho, tiske – tiše, šepetati, torg – trg, tycka("toohe") – tuhtati, udd – ud / okončina, vadra("vedre") – vedriti, vard – vreden, varg – volk, vingaard("vingord"(!)) – vinograd, hraki – hrakelj(izpljunek ob hrakanju), prast – prost, korug("kruh") – kruh, mylnar – mlinar, mylna – mlin, drag – dračje, gass("gos") – gos, kvas – kvas,kvašeno, raka – rak, jordgubbe – jagoda, redding – redič, kvar – kvar, bra – dobra, tarna("trna") – srna, dropp – droptina, strack("strok") – strok, mjod – med, ata,ete – jesti, kupa("keepe") – kipeti, most – mošt, olje – olje, satt – sit, soppa – župa, skorpa – skorja, skum – skominati(cediti sline), slubre – srebati, slen("slin") – slina, tjock("čok") – čok, torr – trd,trdo, dyrka – dirka, hlaupa – hlapec, sula – sulica, radd("rt") – rit, otta("oča") – oče, dykke – dekle, frakka – frača, loka – lok, pridn – priden, val – voliti.

There are of course many more...
"noc und tag" (noč in dan)
"dalen" (dolina; "dol"
"RÄKA = slov. RAK(EC)"
läkare - lekarna (lek; "lečiti" (zdraviti: healer)
etc

thanks I'll glance at the stuff

 

[Sile]

Interesting list. "Night and day" was a joke, wasnt't it?
A simple test is to check whether the Swedish word is also somehow present in English. That would indicate a Germanic or IE root (unless, of course, you believe that Slavs also massively interacted with English, so they equally borrowed Slavic words). I actually intended to do that test, but I couldn't find many of your Swedish words in Swedish-German or Swedish-English dictionaries. If you could add the English translation to your list (and in the process possibly clean it up), it would be easier to discuss your statement.
Nevertheless, a few of your examples are obviously not Slavic, but Germanic/ IE: besök (German Besuch), bunka (German Bunze, Engl. pint), grunda (to ground), hel (whole), koope (German kaufen->English cheap), länk (link), mange (many), mare (nightmare), mena (to mean), minne (mind, Latin: mens), piggi (French: pique), skada (scathe, damage), spoke (spook), tanja ut (to extend, to tension), tycka (to think), värd (worth), vingaard (vineyard), prast (priest), gas (goose), dropp (drop), ata (to eat), kupa (keep n.), most (mesh, fruit juice), olje (oil, Latin root), satt (satiated, German: satt), soppa (soup), skorpa (crust, German Schorf->English scarf), slubre (to slurp), slem (slime), tjock (tight), torr (dry, Low German: dürr), dyrka (to adore, from Latin), sula (sole of a shoe), val (poll, German: Wahl), dalen (dale, valley).

Jordgubbe is an artificial word that was created in 1841 to distinguish the new, artificially bred large strawberry from the small forest strawberries. It is made up from "jord-" (earth) and the old local Swedish word "gubbe" meaning small, rounded clump. And mjöd (mead) was already drunk by Germanics before any antique historian ever mentioned Slavs.

I give you mörk (dark), sen (late), and raka (prawn, crab). Bra (brave) may have a Germanic root, but in the sense of "good" it looks like borrowed from Slavic.

Skum (shady) is a bit tricky. It also exists in German as "Schummer" (dawn) and "Schemen" (shadow, spectre), but especially the first form is relatively recent (18th century) and may be a Slavic borrowing. However, the words are all related to "to shimmer" (display diffuse light), and that root is undoubtedly Germanic. Possibly initially a Slavic borrowing from Germanic, variants of which were later borrowed back into Swedish and Low German. In that case, rather from Pomeranians than from Vikings.
Words that you have missed include gräns (border). It has been borrowed from Slavic "kraina", not only by Swedish, but also German, Danish and Dutch (the latter two probably via German). Gurka (cucumber) was borrowed from Slavs, who had borrowed it from Greeks, who had borrowed it from Persians. German borrowed it in the 16th century, Swedish probably around the same time, again no Vikings involved here. A few more joint German/Swedish borrowings: Peitsche/piska (whip), Quark/kwarg (cottage cheese), Steppe/ stäpp (steppe, from Russian)

That makes ten words - 290 to go. Keep on with your efforts...

Interesting is torg (marketplace). That's obviously not Slavic, but Venetic / Illyrian (Tergeste, Trogir etc.). How did that word make it to the Baltic Sea? The same applies to tiga (to be silent), which doesn't have German or English parallels, but is found in Latin (tacere).

the error is in thinking that Vens is Veneti in this scenario, the Vens in swedish society refer to the
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kven_people
people from the gulf of bothia........between Sweden and Finland...........neither swedes, nor finns..........maybe an ancient race neighboring the saami

 

[epoch]

Skum (shady) is a bit tricky. It also exists in German as "Schummer" (dawn) and "Schemen" (shadow, spectre), but especially the first form is relatively recent (18th century) and may be a Slavic borrowing. However, the words are all related to "to shimmer" (display diffuse light), and that root is undoubtedly Germanic. Possibly initially a Slavic borrowing from Germanic, variants of which were later borrowed back into Swedish and Low German. In that case, rather from Pomeranians than from Vikings.

Dutch: "Schemer" (Twillight) and "Schim" (Shady figure, goast). That makes it seem like a truly germanic word.

Swedish has the word twice, as adjective "shady", and as noun "foam". The latter is found in all Germanic languages except for Modern English - Middle English "skum" didn't survive.

Hell, yes it did. Only it is hardly ever used literally, mostly to call someone scum. As in Dutch, where "schuim" can mean foam as well as lowlife. Merriam-Webster however thinks it is a loanword from Dutch:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/scum

scum

noun \ˈskəm\ : a layer of something unpleasant or unwanted that forms on top of a liquid

: a dishonest, unkind, or unpleasant person




Full Definition of SCUM

1

a : extraneous matter or impurities risen to or formed on the surface of a liquid often as a foul filmy covering — compare pond scum 2
b : the scoria of metals in a molten state : dross
c : a slimy film on a solid or gelatinous object


2

a : refuse
b : a low, vile, or worthless person or group of people

— scum·my adjective


See scum defined for English-language learners »


See scum defined for kids »


Examples of SCUM

• Boil the chicken and use a spoon to remove any scum that floats to the surface.
• <claimed that only scum lived in that part of town>

Origin of SCUM

Middle English, from Middle Dutch schum; akin to Old High German scūm foamFirst Known Use: 14th century

 

[FrankN]

@epoch: Thanks for the correction - I indeed overlooked English "scum".

the error is in thinking that Vens is Veneti in this scenario, the Vens in swedish society refer to the
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kven_people
people from the gulf of bothia........between Sweden and Finland...........neither swedes, nor finns..........maybe an ancient race neighboring the saami

The error is mistaking my term "Venetic/ Illyrian" as ethnographic. It was meant linguistically
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illyrian_languages

Tergitio "merchant"; Alb. tregtar (from treg, market), cf. Old Ch. Slav. trĭgŭ (Serbo-Croat tȑg) "market", Rus. torg "bargain", Lith. tūrgus, Latv. tirgus, Swed. torg. This group is considered to be cognate with the Italian city name of Trieste.

The question remains how "trg/terg/torg" made it from the Adriatic Sea to the Baltic Sea, or vice versa.

 

[MOESAN]

Dutch: "Schemer" (Twillight) and "Schim" (Shady figure, goast). That makes it seem like a truly germanic word.



Hell, yes it did. Only it is hardly ever used literally, mostly to call someone scum. As in Dutch, where "schuim" can mean foam as well as lowlife. Merriam-Webster however thinks it is a loanword from Dutch:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/scum

S-K-M seems a I-Ean wellknown root: breton 'skum(enn)'+ 'spoum(enn)', french 'écume' ('escume') + latin/romanian 'spuma' (irregular?) see english 'foam'<<*pum?
maybe 2 diff- roots?

 

[Sile]

@epoch: Thanks for the correction - I indeed overlooked English "scum".


The error is mistaking my term "Venetic/ Illyrian" as ethnographic. It was meant linguistically
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illyrian_languages

The question remains how "trg/terg/torg" made it from the Adriatic Sea to the Baltic Sea, or vice versa.

maybe you need to find out Liburnian first........they ruled the adriatic from apulia and corfu to istria, they brought the "messapic" langauge from people noted as japodes to apulia.
they settled in italy as north piceni people.

but dalmatian Illyrian and anything south of this, is part of liburnian or "messapic"

Do you actually know if that list of words is from the same area of illyria?..........illyrians had many languages and they where not the same ethnic people

The only word on that list which is active today in venetian language and could have arrived from there is "abeis" ....the venetians say Bis for snake.

the "brisa" meaning is a graspa ( also the alcholicic drink ) in venetian

the "baragon" meaning is a pistor in venetian which ends up as pan

 

[Vedun]

About which Illyrians are you talking about? There are no written sources of Illyrian language at all. You can not re-produce a derivative of a word on the basis of a nation for which we do not know what language they spoke. All you read about so called Illyrians is rather an Albanian nationalistic nonsense and occult claims, theories which were created to write books about them (like about the Atlantis story) and fill the gapes between Ghauls (Celts), Veneti and Etruscans, it is rather a FAITH than anything else... And besides there is no proof that Adriatic Veneti even spoke "terg". This claim comes from Italian nationalists who deny existence of Slovene minority and are still implementing their Apartheid in the 21st century. There even exists a society called Resians which remained the original Rhetic danes and culture - in Slovene language (there is no proof of any mass Slavic expansion in 6th century at all; the only tribe which was migrating were Antes and even they migrated because they were seeking brides (women) in the west (the picture of the mtDNA did not change through the centuries)... current archeological discoveries disprove some mass migration of "proto Slavs" and prove some minor activity of the same tribes, not since 6th century, but already since 1st century... Those tribes came from current Ukraine, which was part of the so called "Scythian" diaspora. In fact is Venetic language rather still a mystery. Why? Because they can not translate 1 Venetic text which has more than 5 words in 1 sentence, so they make everything up; basing those words on the Latin and Italian languages ONLY.. Tell me something; how would you transliterate the Venetic word "TRIMUZIAT" or TRUBOZIAT? Throught the Latin or through the Greek or perhaps through French and German? Now, when I've asked some Italian linguist to translate me some longer text, he failed...If they fail to transliterate the basic "Indo European" Venetic written texts, now imagine about their fairy tales about the so called "Illyrians"..
"Interesting is torg (marketplace). That's obviously not Slavic, but Venetic / Illyrian (Tergeste, Trogir etc.)."

I gave you few examples why TRG or TORG (Trgovati) is Slavic but you did not give me your reasons why you think this is a Venetic word; transliterate this word through the Venetic! (you can not, because you don't even know how sounded "marketing" or any other variants in Venetic.
The other / second form is TRŽIŠČE; Tržiti; Trženje; from this root came TRST and Italian version as "TRIESTE" (after TRG; "Trgeste"; an occult transliteration of TRŽIŠČE); other cities, streets in Slovenia with Lingual root TR are: TRŽIČ, TRŽAŠKA CESTA, TROJANE(Troyane - before Ljubljana), etc...
This is how they (Italians) were re-naming all non-"roman"(transliteration of Etruscan Ruma("Shining; light, sun") cities... until today.

 

[FrankN]

"Interesting is torg (marketplace). That's obviously not Slavic, but Venetic / Illyrian (Tergeste, Trogir etc.)."

I gave you few examples why TRG or TORG (Trgovati) is Slavic but you did not give me your reasons why you think this is a Venetic word; transliterate this word through the Venetic! (you can not, because you don't even know how sounded "marketing" or any other variants in Venetic.
The other / second form is TRŽIŠČE; Tržiti; Trženje; from this root came TRST and Italian version as "TRIESTE" (after TRG; "Trgeste"; an occult transliteration of TRŽIŠČE); other cities, streets in Slovenia with Lingual root TR are: TRŽIČ, TRŽAŠKA CESTA, TROJANE(Troyane - before Ljubljana), etc...
This is how they (Italians) were re-naming all non-"roman"(transliteration of Etruscan Ruma("Shining; light, sun") cities... until today.

Come on, you don't really want to say that Dalmatians have been speaking Slavic in antiquity, which was overlooked by all Roman geographers? Trogir has already in the 3rd century BC been recorded as Tragurion, a Greek colony. The first mentioning of Trieste is by Artemidor of Ephesus (104 BC) under the name of Tergeste. In both cases, "they" spoke and wrote Greek, not Italian. But, don't worry, the Romans used the same names, as can be seen on the Tabula Peutingerania (bottom right):

However, I may actually have been wrong in calling "T-R-G" Illyric-Venetian. There is also this town, which has clearly Etruscan origins:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarquinia
And another possibly Etruscan name
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terracina

Plus, we have this Phoenician trading place
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarragona

And, derived from "Tarku"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarsus,_Mersin

Troy (Troia) as T-R-G market place is probably a bit far-fetched...

Anyway, clear proof that the Vikings already controlled the Mediterranean trade in antiquity, and established torgs everywhere.. :innocent:

PS: If I were to set up a pan-Mediterranean port network, these are some of the places I would consider:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trachoni
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taucheira
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zakros
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thera
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pyrgos_Dirou
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tragano
Tragaki, Zakynthos
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durrës
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oderzo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trani
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triggiano
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taranto

 

[Sile]

About which Illyrians are you talking about? There are no written sources of Illyrian language at all. You can not re-produce a derivative of a word on the basis of a nation for which we do not know what language they spoke. All you read about so called Illyrians is rather an Albanian nationalistic nonsense and occult claims, theories which were created to write books about them (like about the Atlantis story) and fill the gapes between Ghauls (Celts), Veneti and Etruscans, it is rather a FAITH than anything else... And besides there is no proof that Adriatic Veneti even spoke "terg". This claim comes from Italian nationalists who deny existence of Slovene minority and are still implementing their Apartheid in the 21st century. There even exists a society called Resians which remained the original Rhetic danes and culture - in Slovene language (there is no proof of any mass Slavic expansion in 6th century at all; the only tribe which was migrating were Antes and even they migrated because they were seeking brides (women) in the west (the picture of the mtDNA did not change through the centuries)... current archeological discoveries disprove some mass migration of "proto Slavs" and prove some minor activity of the same tribes, not since 6th century, but already since 1st century... Those tribes came from current Ukraine, which was part of the so called "Scythian" diaspora. In fact is Venetic language rather still a mystery. Why? Because they can not translate 1 Venetic text which has more than 5 words in 1 sentence, so they make everything up; basing those words on the Latin and Italian languages ONLY.. Tell me something; how would you transliterate the Venetic word "TRIMUZIAT" or TRUBOZIAT? Throught the Latin or through the Greek or perhaps through French and German? Now, when I've asked some Italian linguist to translate me some longer text, he failed...If they fail to transliterate the basic "Indo European" Venetic written texts, now imagine about their fairy tales about the so called "Illyrians"..
"Interesting is torg (marketplace). That's obviously not Slavic, but Venetic / Illyrian (Tergeste, Trogir etc.)."

I gave you few examples why TRG or TORG (Trgovati) is Slavic but you did not give me your reasons why you think this is a Venetic word; transliterate this word through the Venetic! (you can not, because you don't even know how sounded "marketing" or any other variants in Venetic.
The other / second form is TRŽIŠČE; Tržiti; Trženje; from this root came TRST and Italian version as "TRIESTE" (after TRG; "Trgeste"; an occult transliteration of TRŽIŠČE); other cities, streets in Slovenia with Lingual root TR are: TRŽIČ, TRŽAŠKA CESTA, TROJANE(Troyane - before Ljubljana), etc...
This is how they (Italians) were re-naming all non-"roman"(transliteration of Etruscan Ruma("Shining; light, sun") cities... until today.

The veneti that arrived in the adriatic initially was only a small contingent, they absorbed the Euganei people ( original people ) who where a branch of the raeti people. The venetic language is taken from the euganei, this is the only logical explanation why venetic, raetic , camunic are all very similar language.
The Italians cannot decipher raetic, how do you expect them to decipher venetic.

ALL we know is that archeology of venetic times is from 1150BC...........6 sites in modern west slovenia, 18 sites from Italy to innsbruck austria and the other 320plus sites in north-east italy ( with the bulk southern veneto area) .

Of course there are a few ancient venetic people that remained in Slovenia and became slavs when slavs moved in , the same as there are many "Austrians" there where venetic and became germans when the bavarians moved there.
This silly comment that Slovenes portray that they arrived in Slovenia in the bronze-age is complete nonsense and rubbish