Immigration What should Europeans do with illegal immigrants?

[JackBlack]

I'm not an expert on that matter, some people should no better.
And the situation has not become easier since 2012.
But I ask myself would Syria realy be better without Assad?
Is Lybia better without Khadafi, is Iraq better without Saddam now?
And why not give the Kurds a chance?

Saddam Hussein and Muammar Gadhafi were not necessarily perfect. But under their leadership, those two countries were relatively stable. At least compared to the violence and chaos we see there today. The same in Syria. When Bashar Al-Assad was leading unopposed, there was relative stability compared to the violence and chaos we see now.

It makes you wonder if those 3 men were really the bad guys that they have been made out to be.

 

[LeBrok]

So you have no solution for the Sunni v Shia problem!

Same solution Europe found for Catholic/Protestant/Orthodox problem. But of course, according to you, things like this can't happen in Middle East. European must be the only ones who figured out how to live peacefully together. Oh wait, till Irish and Yugoslavians spoiled it with their religious killings.

And wait, it is still going on on small scale in Scotland, it is still there:

Sports clubs are a focal point for religious communities, more so for (Irish) Catholics than Protestants.^[2] Sectarianism in Glasgow is visible in the rivalry between the supporters of Glasgow's two main football clubs, Celtic and Rangers, collectively known as the Old Firm. One study showed that 74% of Celtic supporters identify themselves as Catholic, whereas only 10% identify as Protestant; for Rangers fans, the figures are 2% and 65%, respectively.^[1] At Rangers' Ibrox Stadium, the Union Flag and Ulster banner are often displayed, whilst at Celtic Park, the Irish tricolour prevails.^[1] During the late 19th century, many immigrants came to Glasgow from Ireland, of whom around 25% were Protestant and around 75% Roman Catholic. The foundation of Celtic, a club with a distinct Irish Roman Catholic identity, was crucial in the subsequent adoption by Rangers of a Protestant, Unionist identity.^[11] From the early 20th century onwards, it is described by prominent Rangers figures that Catholic players were not knowingly signed by the club,^[12] nor employed in other prominent roles as an 'unwritten rule'; however, no official document from the club has ever been produced to prove this.^[13][14][15] Particularly from the 1970s, Rangers came under increasing media pressure to change their stance,^[16] despite several of the club's directors continuing to publicly defend the position

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sectarianism_in_Glasgow

Religious hate crimes in Scotland:
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-15790225

 

[LeBrok]

referring to 20th century Europe all the time and thinking things will resolve itself is what I would call intellectual lazyness

you even don't want to see what is actually happening in the Middle East
I don't think you see a solution but you simply don't want to admit it
you're in far away Canada and it's not your problem, at least not for the moment

Didn't I say EU boots on the ground to finish ISIS? Didn't I say give Sunni and Shia their own countries in Iraq? Didn't I say unite Kurdistan from two parts of Iraq and Syria? This would segregate ethnicities and religions and stabilize Middle East. Same thing that happened in Balkans when Yugoslavia fell apart.
Where you blind reading my posts to miss the solutions?

Anyway we are still waiting for yours.

 

[LeBrok]

Saddam Hussein and Muammar Gadhafi were not necessarily perfect. But under their leadership, those two countries were relatively stable. At least compared to the violence and chaos we see there today.

So were Soviet Union under Stalin and Germany under Hitler. Would you prefer they ruled till today, or their kids, like dictatorship dynasty in North Korea? North Korea is pretty stable too, just from time to time millions need to die of hunger and 10% works in labour camps.

It makes you wonder if those 3 men were really the bad guys that they have been made out to be.

Saddam started 2 wars in Middle East, killed and tortured opposition and gassed his own people. Other than that it was peachy.

 

[JackBlack]

So were Soviet Union under Stalin and Germany under Hitler. Would you prefer they ruled till today, or their kids, like dictatorship dynasty in North Korea? North Korea is pretty stable too, just from time to time millions need to die of hunger and 10% works in labour camps.

Saddam started 2 wars in Middle East, killed and tortured opposition and gassed his own people. Other than that it was peachy.

You got to be kidding me??

One big reason we have this "migrant crisis" is because of the war and chaos in places like Syria and Iraq. Not the ONLY factor, but a significant one. Of course Saddam Hussein was far from perfect. (don't be putting words in my mouth) Under Saddam Hussein, the situation was generally not as bad then as it is now. In fact the situation today in Iraq and Syria could not be any worse!

With that said, Europe has EVERY RIGHT to defend their borders!! Especially since 4 out 5 "Syrian refugees" are not even Syrian.

http://conservativepapers.com/news/...posed-4-out-of-5-migrants-are-not-from-syria/

Rather they are people claiming to be Syrian just to get into Europe.

 

[LeBrok]

You got to be kidding me??

One big reason we have this "migrant crisis" is because of the war and chaos in places like Syria and Iraq. Not the ONLY factor, but a significant one. Of course Saddam Hussein was far from perfect. (don't be putting words in my mouth) Under Saddam Hussein, the situation was generally not as bad then as it is now. In fact the situation today in Iraq and Syria could not be any worse!

It can always be worse. So you rather would keep them under dictatorship indefinitely for the greater good of Near East and the World?

With that said, Europe has EVERY RIGHT to defend their borders!! Especially since 4 out 5 "Syrian refugees" are not even Syrian.

Nobody says they shouldn't protect borders. This crises is emphasized by slow EU response to organize refuge camps and processing on much larger scale than they were used to. Greeks were not in rush to do that, considering they hate Germans now and all refugees were leaving Greece for Germany anyway.

 

[JackBlack]

Why would a Georgian care about the breakdown of European identity?

Anyone who has ever paid any attention to LeBrok's posts knows he's not a Marxist.


If the shoe fits, have the courage to wear it.

Reading Lebrok's posts in this thread, he comes across as a classic politically correct, liberal, cultural marxist!

People who go around talking about "cultural Marxists" are usually Europeans of the racist, Nordicist variety.

People who regularly use the word "racist" when referring to a politically incorrect White European usually anti-White cultural marxist.

 

[LeBrok]

Reading Lebrok's posts in this thread, he comes across as a classic politically correct, liberal, cultural marxist!



People who regularly use the word "racist" when referring to a politically incorrect White European usually anti-White cultural marxist.

Welcome back Kardu from the ban, rather Kardu's sock puppet JackBlack. In every edition of yourself you are transparent as ever.

 

[JackBlack]

Welcome back Kardu from the ban, rather Kardu's sock puppet JackBlack. In every edition of yourself you are transparent as ever.

I have no idea who Kardu is,but he sounds like a level headed, knowledgeable person.

 

[LeBrok]

I have no idea who Kardu is,but he sounds like a level headed, knowledgeable person.

JackBlack was banned being a sock puppet and for using proxy servers. Reminder to all, and specially Kardu. Using proxy servers to log in to Eupedia is forbidden, as is creating "sock puppet" accounts.

 

[Vallicanus]

LeBrok is part of the problem (muddled-headed liberalism) not the solution.

(I am disgusted he is Y-dna R1b like myself.)

There has been no major Catholic v Protestant war in Europe since William of Orange defeated James II in the 1690s.

Sunni v Shia will not be solved by incompetent Westerners.

Migration will continue for decades.

 

[Vallicanus]

Reading Lebrok's posts in this thread, he comes across as a classic politically correct, liberal, cultural marxist!



People who regularly use the word "racist" when referring to a politically incorrect White European usually anti-White cultural marxist.

Correct on all counts.

 

[LeBrok]

Correct on all counts.

Villicanus, can you explain why your IP address changes every time you log in to Eupedia?! Your host claims it is a static IP, yet your IP is different every single day. I'm suspecting you are another Kardu's sock puppet. Are you using proxy server?

 

[Vallicanus]

Villicanus, can you explain why your IP address changes every time you log in to Eupedia?! Your host claims it is a static IP, yet your IP is different every single day. I'm suspecting you are another Kardu's sock puppet. Are you using proxy server?

I'm not anybody's sock puppet.

However your views are clones of Marxist super-babble.


Shia v Sunni will decide the future of the Middle East and by extension (continuing migration crisis) Europe too for decades to come and all the liberal happy talk in the world cannot change that, sorry.

 

[LABERIA]

It is never going to happen, because most people rather stay in their country, culture, religion and countrymen in general. Most of these refugees don't have money for such trip or are afraid of their families and kids. Pretty much whoever could afford and wanted pretty much already left.
Having said that, depending how this conflict unfolds we might see more displaced people. If it quiets down or stay the same we will see fewer.
If Europe don't want to see more refugees from Syria, it is imperative to make sure they have a good life in refugee camps/housing, and make sure ISIS is finished soon.

Russia definitely is doing something that Putin considers positive for Russia or his interest. What it is we can only speculate. Is he going to just support Assad (his client for military and industrial goods), at the same time securing Russian influence in the Middle East, and improving his ratings for next election? How is he going to react to Kurdish issue, when Kurds are pro-western and potential a NATO member? He might cooperate with PKK against Turkey potentially. He might have a goal to destabilize Middle East to bring oil prices back to 100 bucks per barrel, without which Russia will go into a deep recession in a year or two, and this would make Russians unhappy and end his presidency.

I agree with all the reasons cited by you. But the main and common reason of conflict in Ukraine and Syria, is the control over the Mediterranean Sea.

 

[LeBrok]

Ok, another Kardu's proxy server sock puppet Villicanus banned. Kardu, your only profile left now on Eupedia. Make sure you don't use proxy server when posting here. Be honest with us, don't hid behind proxy like a coward. Be an honest proud man.

 

[LeBrok]

I agree with all the reasons cited by you. But the main and common reason of conflict in Ukraine and Syria, is the control over the Mediterranean Sea.

Definitively taking over Crimea by Russia has happened to insure their naval port in Center of Black Sea stays in Russian hands. It is highly strategic place, and there was a risk it will be lost if Ukraine joins NATO. War in Ukraine has few goals, like building need in Russians that Putin is savor and defender of Russians, destabilizing Ukraine to discourage Nato against Ukrainian membership and sending message to Nato that Russia is still alive, important and can bite if needed.
I'm not sure what he wants to accomplish in Syria though. The money to be made off Assad is not much. Russia need to spend a lot of mony fighting with ground troops there. We are talking about spending hundreds of billions for war effort and rebuilding Syria. Syria doesn't have the money, so it will come from pockets of Russians. Unless, their is an agreement to pay Russians by Saudis and Kuwaitis? In this case Russians are mercenaries in this conflict, who will make billions there fighting and rebuilding. It would make sense but I didn't hear about such Saudi-Russian partnership.
Frankly speaking, it is actually in Russian interest to mess up Near East and capitalize on higher oil prices and selling weapons. With today's oil prices Putin is short tens of billions of dollars every year to balance the budget. If it stays like this for couple of years, Russia will dive into a deep recession and unhappy Russians will never elect Putin again. He needs to do something quickly!

 

[Yetos]

ok

I found at news that 20 000 Chinese Muslims are marching to fight at Syrria with the side of DAESH,
a total of 80 000 Uyghurs is about to settle at Syrria at borders with Turkey in the lands DAESH is controling now,

Does anyone has find such information?
I just want to cross it, to see if it is fictional or true

 

[bicicleur 2]

Didn't I say EU boots on the ground to finish ISIS? Didn't I say give Sunni and Shia their own countries in Iraq? Didn't I say unite Kurdistan from two parts of Iraq and Syria? This would segregate ethnicities and religions and stabilize Middle East. Same thing that happened in Balkans when Yugoslavia fell apart.
Where you blind reading my posts to miss the solutions?

Anyway we are still waiting for yours.

ok, boots on the ground, finish ISIS and a create a united Kurdistan
I agree
but Turkey stands in the way
NATO wants to keep Turkey as a friend and allows them to bomb the Kurds
should we allow Turkey to get away with that?
and how about Syria, Assad an those other rebel fractions? Is there any fraction in Syria to be trusted and capable of maintaining power?
I don't believe in a Sunni and a Shia nation living together peacefully.
So should we leave Assad in power?
Wherever there is no strong power to maintain stability, Islamist fighters from outside will come to interfere and destabilise.
As long as Islamist fundamentalists are not eradicated worldwide, democracy is not possible in these countries.

 

[bicicleur 2]

ok

I found at news that 20 000 Chinese Muslims are marching to fight at Syrria with the side of DAESH,
a total of 80 000 Uyghurs is about to settle at Syrria at borders with Turkey in the lands DAESH is controling now,

Does anyone has find such information?
I just want to cross it, to see if it is fictional or true

they too?
I don't know
if true, it will become known